I have a confession. I am a socialist.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

:wtf: is the big deal? I think everyone is equal, I think everyone should get health care as a right, and I believe the rich should be taxed more than the middle class. I believe in collective bargaining.
:shrug:
Oh, and I believe capitalism causes more harm than good. And the people who are the most conservative are usually the most "Christian", which means they believe in Christ. And according to what I've read in the bible, greed and capitalism are pretty much sins.
Discuss.
Oh, this should be fun!

[white_wolf]

1. Hello. Welcome to the club.

Trotskyist here.

[bbinacan]

2. .

:popcorn:

[Drale]

3. I enjoy when tea baggers call me a socialist like its a curse

and I thank them. Sometimes I think their heads are going to explode trying to work it out.

[Shiver]

4. Good for you.

I'm a Discordian. :7

[YellowRubberDuckie]

5. What is a discordian?

[Shiver]

35. A fake real religion.

Confusion is the natural state of the universe. The problems of the world arise when mankind attempts to force order upon it.

Take a look at the http://www.principiadiscordia.com/">Principia Discordia and let me know if you get the joke.

"The human race will begin solving it's problems on the day that it ceases taking itself so seriously."

Fnord?

[Billy Burnett]

6. Just don't promote ant socialist candidates here.

Or you'll get TSed.

:toast:

[inna]

7. no big deal, at all. many of us are socialists - at least, by beliefs, if not card-carrying ones.nt

[Imajika]

8. What type of socialism?

What is your model?

Democratic socialists countries like in parts of Western Europe? Or more hard line socialist countries like Cuba?

[Buzz Clik]

9. Socialists are more fun when they refraine from calling those who disagree with them "corporatists"

Beyond that, I have no problem with them.

Some of my best friends are socialists, but I wouldn't want my daughter to marry one.

You don't have to worry about socialists moving in next door because they don't believe in ownership of property.

The most dangerous person in the world is a socialist with a credit card.

[inna]

11. "socialists don't believe in ownership of property" - it's a myth.

[Buzz Clik]

12. Here's another myth that needs to be dispelled:

My post was serious.

:eyes:

[inna]

14. lol, sorry then! you certainly got me.

[Buzz Clik]

21. My bad.

You're a good sport.

[inna]

26. i take it as a compliment :)

"You're a good sport." - mutual. :)

[white_wolf]

29. He got me too.

Good job. :)

[white_wolf]

13. There is a section of the Manifesto where Marx addresses this

I'll try and find it later and post it. Anyway Socialists (and I mean hardline Marxists) are fine with personal property such as houses, tvs, cars, etc. What we are not fine with is private property as in the means of production being privately owned.

[Buzz Clik]

23. Well, white_wolf, I was kidding about that. However, ....

... I see that it prompted you to start a new thread on the subject. I will definitely read it and be educated.

[Curmudgeoness]

15. Since when do socialists not believe in owning property?

This is a new one to me.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

19. I own a home?

:shrug:
So I'm NOT a socialist?
Damn.

[Odin2005]

25. EDIT, didn't realize the post was a joke.

[Buzz Clik]

27. no doubt.

[readmoreoften]

53. Your post is dealing with a strawman socialist.

1) "Corporatist" is a liberal term meaning capitalist for those who are too timid to directly call capitalism what it is, or who think that there is good "healthy" capitalism as opposed to pathological "corporatism".

2) Socialists believe in personal property, just not privatization. Everyone isn't going to share the same toothbrush or underwear, that's not the point. But we will collectively own the water and the oil reserves.

3) Whether or not they are moralizing idealists depends on whether they are from the utopian socialist tradition, like Saint Simon, or the Marxist materialist tradition. A utopian socialist might blame capitalism on "greedy people" but a Marxist knows that greed is an epiphenomenon produced by the system itself. For that reason, "good capitalists or bad capitalists" can not exist. If capitalists want to survive as capitalists and not fall into the working class, they'll have to behave according to the profit motive. It has nothing to do with morality.

4) Your comment "socialist with a credit card" seems like a lighthearted jab at the "hypocrisy" of a socialist participating in the capitalist system as a consumer. But most socialists, other than the anarchosocialists, don't advocate for moralistically dropping out of society because that doesn't change a damn thing. Having or not having a credit card, or other boycott behaviors are also not socialist methods of revolt. They are liberal methods of revolt. Socialists--the materialist kind at least--advocate for disruption at the level of production not consumption. Strikes not "personally remaining pure by refusing to have a credit card."

A socialist with a credit card isn't dangerous. They're just like every other shlub with a credit card: in debt to a system that openly abandoned the working class a few decades ago.

[socialist_n_TN]

61. RE: Your last paragraph......

In one sense, I'm kind of glad that the system relies so much on credit. It means the working class has one more weapon in the arsenal to use AGAINST the capitalists when the time comes.

It used to be that the only weapon we had, non-violently, was the withholding of our labor, i.e., strike. Now since so much of the capitalist infrastructure is built on credit, we can ALSO withhold our money on the debt we've rung up. Couple those two weapons and, IF we were organized, we actually could come close to bringing the whole of capitalism down WITHOUT A SHOT BEING FIRED.

[readmoreoften]

54. Sorry, didn't realize the post was a joke.

It's about par for the course of what I hear. Unfortunately, your humor is a bit too dry to not warrant the ol' drippy blood tag. ;)

[Terra Alta]

10. I'm a socialist, too.

I believe the rich should be taxed 50% at least, and the richest of the rich taxed at 75%. I believe every American ought to have access to affordable health care, food, and shelter. And if that means giving food stamps to everyone, then so be it. No one in this country should go to bed hungry.

Jesus Christ was a socialist. If conservative Christians actually read the Gospels - the entire Gospels, not just what they like - they would realize that.

It amazes me when Repukes say Obama is a socialist. God, if only that were true.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

22. I love you, Terra Alta.

I say that same stuff ALL THE TIME!

[cordelia]

64. Yes!

[OwnedByFerrets]

16. If its good enough for Bernie Sanders, its good enough for ME

[madinmaryland]

17. This is HUGH! I am a Socalist also!!

I am for Socalized medicine for all!!

:D

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=105&topic_id=1198&mesg_id=1684

[bullimiami]

18. ME TOO!

[Curmudgeoness]

20. It is no big deal, at least not to me.

I also believe that essential industries should be government run instead of profit driven.

I believe that a nation's natural resources belong to the nation, not to the highest bidder.

I believe that all people should have access to life's essentials like health care, a place to live, enough food, a good education.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

28. Here Here!

You should have to mortgage your home to send your kids to college. And you shouldn't have to work your ass off for food, shelter and health care. We should all work together for the greater good.
What the hell is wrong with these people who think it's OK that a nation as rich as ours has children in it who go to bed hungry every night?! Pisses me OFF.

[Curmudgeoness]

32. Glad you are out of the closet. Pisses a lot of us off. nt

[ejpoeta]

43. as long as it isn't them or their children, then it's all good.

[Odin2005]

24. Join the club!

:hi:

[Lydia Leftcoast]

30. I have gradually come to realize that I am a Socialist, too,

although a Democratic one as in Scandinavia.

[YellowRubberDuckie]

31. I am a Democratic one as well.

:evilgrin:

[vim876]

33. I am Spartacus.

Oops. I mean I'm a socialist.

[socialist_n_TN]

46. Welcome to DU comrade.......

:)

NO! I am Spartacus!

[madrchsod]

34. i knew that the first time i saw- yellowrubberduckie -on the DU...

[YellowRubberDuckie]

36. ...

:hug:

[geckosfeet]

37. me too - my friend

[Kceres]

38. Maybe there is a socialistunderground? I'd join. Youbetcha.

[white_wolf]

39. You do realize this is a forum for democrats and other progressives?

Socialist fall into the "other progressives" category.

[a la izquierda]

40. No worries, there are a bunch here.

Myself included.

[jwirr]

41. The book of Acts in the Bible is where I first decided to be a socialist. nt

[Zax2me]

42. The thing is, your ideas won't work here.

Well, they could, but not now with capitalist laws and culture en-grained within every pore of our society.
The same reason people get disappointed with Obama. It's not like he is not a progressive - he just can't implement a progressive agenda into an active capitalist society. Not at a pace many would require to still support him.
Which is why I doubt it will ever happen.

[unkachuck]

44. I'm with you....

....Socialism, the ultimate in family values!

[socialist_n_TN]

45. Welcome comrade! You secret decoder ring........

is in the mail! :rofl:

Seriously though there ARE a lot of us (and elsewhere in the country) on here and there's more every day. This very board has gone from about 30%/40% socialist of one stripe or another when I first started posting to 60% or so. And that's in just a year and a half.

I think it's the overreach by the RW myself. The BEST recruiter for socialism is a capitalist.

[Courtesy Flush]

47. Jesus said sell all your belongings and give to the poor

I'm not sure how that squares with the greed they're preaching these days.

[martymar64]

48. So am I . . . and proud of it!

[donheld]

49. me too

[applegrove]

50. I agree with your first paragraph. But I don't think that is what makes you a socialist.

[Critters2]

51. I am, too. Card-carrying, dues-paying member of both Democratic Socialists of America

and Social Democrats USA.

It's less scary to admit to being bisexual than socialist in this country, in my experience.

[Modern_Matthew]

55. Been thinking about joining DSA... couple of questions:

You actually get a card?

What else do you get? Some kind of privileged access to a forum or other member portal on their site?

[Critters2]

60. Don't get an actual card with DSA.

Do get one with SDUSA. Also had one with SPUSA when I belonged to that.

With DSA, you get their really well-done newsletter, Democratic Left, and membership in your local, and the opportunity to attend larger meetings. I'm 90 miles from my local, so don't get to many things, but I like to support 'em financially. Dues for DSA are way cheaper than SDUSA.

[Jack Sprat]

52. I have become a socialist myself now that I have

seen all the ugliness that capitalism has become. And it is getting worse all the time as the socialist safety nets fall. Not only that, but I can see how capitalism manages to consume everything including democracy. Capitalism and communism seem to have an end result very similar, in that the people who run these economies live great in the minority in charge. The great majority of the population lives in poverty by contrast, and they have no political means of doing anything about it short of revolution. A socialist democracy would be my dream of a new America.

[Name removed]

56. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[upi402]

57. You & Jesus & me!

We can be "Jesus & Pals - the godless commies".:grouphug: awwww

I'm still a Democrat. The Dems have moved to Goldwater Republicanism, and the Repukes are fascists.

By standing still, I've run to the far left?

[libmom74]

58. I confess that I am too.

Socialism is the most humane system and I believe more democratic. Our current form of laissez faire free market capitalism is antithetical to democracy.

[eallen]

59. I'm a liberal. I believe capitalism is absolutely necessary.

Yes, the rich should be taxed more. Yes, we should move to a single-payer health system. Yes, we should spend more on education and research.

But if you want all that, you have to have an economy that generates the wealth to pay for it. And no nation has figured out a way to do that without capitalism. From Sweden to China, from Canada to France, the rich nations all provide a route for entrepreneurial ownership, all have private companies, and all feature equity markets. I.e., capitalism.

Yes, capitalism has its problems. Yes, companies need to be regulated in areas from pollution to worker safety. But eliminate capitalism, because it "causes more harm than good"? We'e seen the results of that. I'll stay a liberal, in favor of capitalism.

:hippie:

[dawg]

63. what he said!

:yourock:

[BOG PERSON]

62. i have a confession too

i'm an alcoholic. i am not a dependable person.

wow! that's a load off my chest. thanks for listening.

[white_wolf]

65. I wonder what percentage of this site considers themselves

socialist. Someone should make a poll.

[socialist_n_TN]

69. The last one I did on this very subject showed..........

70% considered themselves socialist of one stripe or another.

[dawg]

66. greed is a sin - capitalism is not

If I own the means of production, I'm entitled to a reasonable return on my investment. If I provide you with the tools and facilities with which you do your job, I deserve to be paid for that.

Likewise, to the extent I provide management services to arrange work, provide supplies and raw materials, and sell the finished product, I deserve fair compensation for my time, energy, and skills.

The problem arises when I, as an owner, start demanding more than my fair share. Growing fabulously wealthy from the efforts of others is immoral. But that isn't a problem with capitalism. It's a problem with many individual capitalists.

[white_wolf]

71. Could it not be argued that is the the kind of people

who capitalism attracts and the ones most likely to succeed?

[dawg]

73. Yes, and that is why we need government regulation.

Unregulated capitalism devolves into an exploitative mess and eventually destroys itself.

[Tierra_y_Libertad]

67. I told the XO of the squadron I was in, in the marines, I was a Marxist.

His response: "So?"

[Cascadian]

68. I am a Democratic Socialist with Libertarian and Green leanings

Try to top that one! There's nothing wrong with being an idealist in politics!



John

(The Cascadian is back!)

[white_wolf]

70. That's a good combo.

Now on to the different subject of strange parties how about the Libertarian-National-Socialist-Green-Party. I can't decide if they are real or a joke.

[Cascadian]

72. I've seen that website.

I think it's a parody.




John

(The Cascadian is back!)