A DU silent thread of support for Socialism.

[bobthedrummer]

:hi:

[lunatica]

1. +.

[PonyJon]

191. R U KIDDING? SCREAM SOCIALISIM IN THE STREETS!

DEMOCRATIC, of course.

[Scuba]

2. ..

[MineralMan]

3. Unrecced. This is a discussion forum, not a silent forum.

Silent threads accomplish nothing.

[Name removed]

5. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[MineralMan]

11. At least it was a post.

I'm a supporter of socialism. It has great potential, although I do not know how it could be implemented in the US without a rewriting of the Constitution. I can't see that as a possibility in the conceivable future.

My objection is to silent threads on DU. I voiced that objection. I get to post in threads here, as does everyone else. I have no power over anything here, so I can't really be a nanny of anyone.

[tekisui]

12. It never stops you from trying, though.

[MineralMan]

15. I don't take your meaning, I'm afraid.

[Enthusiast]

154. Be afraid, be very afraid.

And remember, the only thing we have to fear, is fear itself.

[Fuddnik]

212. Why is that not surprising?

[libmom74]

73. Why would the Constitution

have to be rewritten? There is no explicit statement in the Constitution that states the US must be a capitalist nation.

[Chisox08]

176. Why does constitution needs to be rewritten?

I just reread the constitution and nowhere did I read about capitalism. As a matter of fact capitalism is not even mentioned once. So can you show me where in the constitution that sets up a capitalist economic system?

[PonyJon]

188. The preamble to the constitution

at the very top of the document states that it's purpose is "to promote the common WELFARE" it is per se a socialist manifesto.

[WhiteTara]

6. A silent thread made news when done on the House

floor.
Speechless.

[pintobean]

20. A rarity; I'm with you on this one.

This is silly.

[MineralMan]

24. Thanks. We agree on more than you think.

I've just never understood the silent thread thing. I can't find the point in an empty thread on a discussion forum. So, I said so. I've never mentioned it before.

[Enthusiast]

155. Don't like it?

Don't participate.

[pintobean]

164. Thanks

but, I'll think for myself. I see you're participating in the spirit of the op.

[roguevalley]

53. in honor of my grandpa, Rowland Ward Bishop, proprietor of the

Square Deal Dairy that went bust in the 30's due to depression. For you, Grandpa.

[truedelphi]

61. + a silent 1. n/t

[Vanje]

118. and my Grandpa....

Gustav S Linstedt, Bonus-marcher, Christian and proud Socialist.

[harmonicon]

70. I'm with you there. nt.

[defendandprotect]

98. SILENCE .... is also a response -- !!

[Fumesucker]

101. Eh, you have a habit of telling other people what to post..

I've seen you do it several times, it's just as pointless a behavior as a silent thread.

[Vanje]

119. .....

.....(fart noise)

[Change has come]

128. Thank you for your concern.

:kick:

[Bucky]

166. Shhh

 



(heathen)




 

[tekisui]

4. !!!!!!!

[prairierose]

7. ++++++++++++++++++++++++

+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

[Dyedinthewoolliberal]

8. I'm in!

:fistbump:

[Pab Sungenis]

9. ..

..

[white_wolf]

10. +1000

[Kurovski]

13. .

.

[pacalo]

14. You bet!

A government of, for, & by the people!

[HereSince1628]

16. --

[Warren Stupidity]

17. !

[sasha031]

18. ...1

:thumbsup:

[Dappleganger]

19. ...

:toast:

[Lorien]

21. ...

[jdadd]

22. ........

[lumberjack_jeff]

23. Silent threads on a discussion board are odd.

Particularly when they don't pertain to some sort of tragedy.

[MineralMan]

26. I agree. They just don't seem to make sense.

It's sort of like the old "K&R if you like cheese" threads. I never understood those, either.

[pintobean]

27. Really, aren't they all silent?

[MineralMan]

32. LOL!

Very good. On the other hand, there could be folks using a text reader to follow DU. In fact, I'll bet there is at least one blind regular DUer. For them, the thread would be silent. You'd hear a computer generated voice, saying:

Plus Sign One
Period Period Period Period
Exclamation Point One One Exclamation Point

And so on. And the blind DUer goes, "WTF?"

:rofl:

[lumberjack_jeff]

75. Silent threads: 100% less snark.

:rofl:

[joshcryer]

48. Whether socialism is a tragedy is certainly something to consider...

...given the political atrocities that the implementors have committed over the decades.

[liberation]

94. That could be said for any -ism, no?

[joshcryer]

133. Politically, nothing comes even remotely close.

Economically, now, that's an entirely different matter.

[2banon]

141. you think capitalism hasn't racked up it's share of death and destruction on a massive scale?

think again. Almost the entire globe bears the scars from of imperialist/colonialist capitalism invasions, occupations and regime changes, not to mention proxy wars for Corporations of every sector.

We need a new socio-economic and political paradigm that isn't based on theft of resources of other nations and on the backs of low wage/slave labor.

[joshcryer]

144. I'm differentiating between political and economic suppression.

Both capitalism and state socialism are extreme sides of the same fucking coin. They're fundamentally identical in the end.

[2banon]

220. I gotcha.. i misread ya...thanks for the clarification!

:hi:

[Jackpine Radical]

198. Yes, we all remember the horrors and atrocities perpetrated by

the Danes, the Finns, the Swedes…

[tomp]

174. if there are atrocities, it's not socialism. nt

[Chan790]

184. Bollocks.

It's the -ism that's the problem. All -isms are oppression (and frequently acts of mass-insanity), socialism is not excepted.

[tomp]

222. bollocks, yourself.

-ism is just part of a word. words are not the problem. we do witness mass insanity all the time in human affairs. don't blame the words.

[joshcryer]

218. If it's implemented under the name of Marx, Lenin, Trotsky, it is fucking socialism.

I don't care what you say, that's what the word means.

Your statement might be true if you were referring to libertarian socialism, but you're not.

[tomp]

221. sorry, that's patently wrong.

anyone can SAY they're following anyone, that doesn't mean they are.

right now, socialism is still an idea that has never been fully implemented. there have been several attempts with no complete success and a lot of complete failures.

[Shiver]

25. Nah

[Initech]

28. Bill Maher on the subject:

http://www.hbo.com/#/real-time-with-bill-maher/episodes/0/200-episode/article/new-rules.html

[proud2BlibKansan]

29. ....

:thumbsup:

[MilesColtrane]

30. I support the Nordic model of a mixed market Social Democracy, so I'll just whisper.

[MineralMan]

33. Truly. You wouldn't want to draw too much attention to yourself.

Uff da!

[murphyj87]

55. And Canada is much like that too... nt

[freshwest]

63. ((((((((((Nationalize everything)))))))))))

[Enthusiast]

156. Only the petroleum exploration and production,

all water resources, all power generation and transmission and all medical care (except the purely charitable) and pharmaceutical production and any banks and related institutions found guilty of mortgage and derivatives fraud.

That should be a good start. I'm sure there are more that would be in the interest of the common welfare.

[Chan790]

185. So do I.

Imagine Norway. As Walter said: "If you will it, Dude, it is no dream."

[roody]

31. knr

[patrice]

34. Why silent? Did it die?

[GoddessOfGuinness]

131. +1

[Donnachaidh]

35. +++ k/r! n/t

[snagglepuss]

36. ,

:)

[xchrom]

37. .

[dana_b]

38. .

[Kceres]

39. +1

[jwirr]

40. ....

:bounce:

[swilton]

41. K one thousand

R one thousand

[mike_c]

42. +

[Starry Messenger]

43. .

[SidDithers]

44. ROFL...

Yay Socialism!!

Sid

[PBS Poll-435]

49. Shhhhh.

SILENT!!1!

[AllyCat]

45. .

[Lugnut]

46. ----------

[mod mom]

47. .

[txlibdem]

50. ***

[Terra Alta]

51. .

K&R

[tavalon]

52. .........

[LWolf]

54. .

:hi:

[jtrockville]

56. .........

[franzia99]

57. You should elaborate on the definition of socialism

Are we talking about the Soviet brand of socialism, or European free day care socialism? Socialism has been used to describe so many things further defining is needed.

[silverweb]

65. Try the U.S. brand?

Social Democrats USA

:)

[Critters2]

107. :whispering: I'm a member. nt

[silverweb]

151. ...

[white_wolf]

126. I'm a fan of Trotskyism, personally.

[BOG PERSON]

219. gross

[Enthusiast]

157. Yeah, we want

Soviet style socialism.

You know, the repressive cruel authoritarian system that allowed privileged party hierarchy to live lives of luxury while the people stood in bread lines. We also like that state controlled media where there was only one acceptable point of view. And there was that concentration of scarce resources into a pure military focus at the expense of the citizens. Now that was truly a system worth emulating.

[me b zola]

58. ...

:thumbsup:

[MrMickeysMom]

59. +

:hi:

:hi: :hi:
:hi: :hi: :hi:

[donnamarie]

60. :)

[socialist_n_TN]

62. I'm in.........

[silverweb]

64. *whispers*

The Torch meets the Rose.

[leftstreet]

66. They'll keep shoveling their capitalism on us UNTIL WE GET LOUD !!

:-)

[Plucketeer]

97. They've already shoveled

to the point where there's nothing left.

[Zephie]

67. ......

:hi:

[TheKentuckian]

68. +

[ismnotwasm]

69. +

[cosmic _mind]

71. .......

:toast: :toast:

[stockholmer]

72. what a democratic eco-socialist platform looks like (from my party, the Swedish Green Party)

We made huge gains in the 2010 elections, the highest percentage growth of any major party, and that was BEFORE Fukushima.


----------------------------------------------------



Raise quality within welfare, invest in educationtion


1. No-one should be without insurance

Everyone should be covered by secure and modern health insurance. We want sickness benefit to be available for as long as people are ill and we want to get rid of the health insurance ceiling. Society has a particular responsibility for providing effective rehabilitation. Everyone should be covered by general unemployment insurance.

2. Shorter working hours

We want to reduce normal working hours to 35 hours a week to give people more time and increase their quality of life. As an initial step we want to introduce support for parents of young children to allow them to reduce their hours, and we want to reintroduce the sabbatical year. We want to introduce more flexibility around retirement age and create opportunities to reduce working hours as people approach retirement.

3. Diversity at school

While at school children are entitled to learn the skills that they will need as they enter adult life. Parents and children will have good opportunities to influence teaching and be able to choose a method that suits the child. All children will have the attention and time that they need with adults in school and at nursery. Quality in Swedish nurseries and primary and secondary schools therefore needs to be improved. We need to increase the teacher-pupil ratio, reduce class sizes and increase the amount of scheduled teaching time. We want to protect diversity in schools, teaching and educational focus. We want to strengthen pupil democracy and invest in pupil healthcare.


4. Let children be children

A playful and safe childhood should be a universal right. A society that is good for children is good for everyone. We want to boost children’s rights and incorporate the UN Convention on the Rights of the Child into Swedish law.

5. Preventive care

Healthcare and nursing need to adopt a preventive approach that promotes healthy living. Healthcare will be equal for all and be located close to citizens. It will be characterised by teamwork and broad medical and psychosocial expertise. Special initiatives are required in order to reduce mental ill-health and improve elderly care. Checks and monitoring will be enhanced to reduce cases of incorrect use of medication.

6. Good food

We want to improve the quality of food in schools, hospitals and homes for the elderly. Children, older people and sick people will be served freshly cooked meals from local kitchens in schools, homes and hospitals instead of heated up food that is driven long distances. When procuring services the focus will be on organic ingredients and locally produced food, which is why the law on public procurement needs to be reviewed to allow the promotion of local purchasing. Tasty and nutritional food is a natural aspect of welfare.


7. A strong higher education system and increased student grants

The education system is a key aspect of a modern knowledge-based society. Quality in higher education institutions will be improved by increasing the amount of contact time for the students and a greater focus on good teaching methods. We want to offer people new opportunities and to make it easier to study at all stages in life. That’s why we want to raise the student grant and improve students’ social safety net. Cooperation will be strengthened between universities/higher education institutions and the business sector.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


A just and sustainable world is possible


1. Active global climate policy

We must reduce global emissions of greenhouse gases. We want to campaign globally to phase out all subsidies on coal, oil and nuclear power. We want to introduce environmental control charges for fossil fuels within international airline and shipping operations to cover the cost of climate initiatives in poor countries. We must increase international support for climate measures in developing countries.

2. Tackle poverty

We want to work for fair trade that takes account of the needs of the poor countries. The level of aid given by Sweden will be at least one percent of GNI. Sweden will campaign to write off illegitimate debts and ensure that poor countries do not fall into debt traps. Tackling poverty will be a key element of foreign, trade and development aid policy.

3. Phase out export of arms

We want to phase out the export of arms. An initial step will be to toughen up regulations for Swedish weapons exports. It is unacceptable for Swedish weapons to be exported to countries that are involved in human rights abuses. We say no to investing additional billions in a new, upgraded version of the JAS fighter plane. Sweden should remain outside NATO. We must step up efforts to establish peace in the world. We also want to prohibit the manufacture of mines and cluster bombs in Sweden.

4. Stop overfishing in our seas

All subsidies must be removed that contribute towards overfishing. Cod and other species of fish in our seas should not be fished if their numbers fall below safe levels. Strong measures are required to tackle illegal fishing. We will also review Sweden’s trade policy to help reduce overfishing in other seas around the world.

5. Respect for human rights in refugee policy

We want to create more legal routes for migration to the EU. A more humane refugee policy is needed. There have long been deficiencies in the Swedish migration process, which is why we want to carry out an amnesty for all those without papers. The best interests of the child will be prioritised in the assessment of all refugee cases. Those without papers should be entitled to healthcare and have the right to attend school.

6. No to EMU

We want Sweden to keep its own currency and not join the EMU. The EU must be more democratic and less centralised. The EU should not have a common defence policy


------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


An equal society increases freedom


1. Equality at home and on the board

Both parents are entitled to be at home with their children and the child has the right to be with both parents. We want parental insurance to be divided into three periods, with the parents each being assigned a certain number of days and the third period being divided up as they choose. This will improve opportunities to divide up parental leave in an equal manner. We want to introduce a law on quotas for the number of women on the boards of listed companies and public sector companies.

2. Women’s safety is freedom

We want to increase resources to women’s refuges working with domestic violence. The justice system must handle cases with skill and respect. Rape laws will be strengthened to guarantee sexual integrity. Children who have witnessed violence in the home will be regarded as victims of crime. People who are convicted of assault will be forced to undergo treatment. Violence against men and violence within same sex relationships must also be given attention. More resources are needed to tackle prostitution and human trafficking.


3. Equal rights for all

Discrimination legislation needs to be toughened up. We want to promote equal rights at companies and government agencies. Local anti-discrimination agencies will be strengthened. We want to continue to campaign for the rights of homosexual, bisexual and transsexual people. Efforts to tackle hate crime will be stepped up. Everyone will have the opportunity to participate fully in society. We want lack of access to be classed as discrimination against people with disabilities under the law.

4. Learning using native language

One of the most efficient ways of improving school results for children whose native language is not Swedish is to invest more in native language teaching. We want to extend the right to native language teaching to cover the entire compulsory schooling period. We also want to increase subject teaching in children’s native language.


5. Jobs and training for newcomers

Newcomers to Sweden will be offered opportunities to learn Swedish quickly, validate or supplement their training and get a job. We want Swedish language studies to be combined with practical experience. We want to improve quality in Swedish as a second language. We want universities and higher education institutions to offer courses in Swedish for people coming to Sweden with an academic education.


6. Defend the right to a private life

People’s right to a private life is being restricted across society. We want to strengthen the regulations regarding camera surveillance so that individual integrity is taken into consideration. The state will not be able to register all Internet user traffic in Sweden. We want to abolish the FRA law on changes to defence intelligence activities.

7. A free internet and balanced copyright legislation

We want to protect the rule of law and integrity on the internet by making changes to the IPRED law on file sharing. We want to modernise copyright law and decriminalise file sharing for private use. Net neutrality is an important principle that must be defended.


----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

New jobs, entrepreneurship and small companies


1. Reduced VAT for service companies

We want to encourage growth in the service sector by reducing VAT within several industries. It will be cheaper to repair broken items, eat at restaurants, go to the hairdresser and fix a bicycle. Sustainable consumption of services must be encouraged and we want to take an initial step towards achieving this during the mandate period.

2. Reduced tax for small companies

We want to reduce payroll tax for small companies by ten percentage points. We want sole traders to have an additional reduction for the first employee during the first year of operation.

3. Venture capital for SMEs

We want to introduce a state venture capital fund to make it easier for more small and medium-sized companies to have access to venture capital. The fund will be financed from dividends from the state companies.


4. Trade and industry at the forefront

A lot of new entrepreneurs are motivated by the desire to take greater ethical, social and environmental responsibility. This contributes towards sustainable development. We need to encourage this approach. We want to increase grants for innovation, product development and environmental technology development at small and medium-sized companies. The state and municipal companies will contribute towards new environmental technology, renewable energy and act as an example when it comes to reducing climate impact. Social and cooperative enterprise will be part of a green entrepreneur policy. We work to encourage more companies to start up in rural areas. We want to actively work to utilise and improve opportunities to take social, ethical and environmental aspects into consideration during the public procurement process.

5. Jobs and training for young people

We want to introduce a trainee programme in the welfare sector. We also need to invest more in professional training programmes and apprenticeships. More higher education institutions will offer work experience at companies and authorities as part of the training programme.

6. An open and varied cultural life

A vibrant and creative cultural life is a key success factor for health, quality of life and the development of society. We want to invest in culture so that everyone, particularly children and young people, is given the opportunity to participate in various different cultural activities, both actively and as a member of the audience. Schools of culture will be strengthened. Culture is a climate friendly alternative to material consumption.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


Invest in new jobs and reducing climate impact


1. Sweden will take its share of the responsibility

Sweden has to take its share of global responsibility. Emissions of greenhouse gases will decrease in accordance with researchers’ recommendations. Increases to green taxes will make it more expensive to use fossil fuels.

2. Double capacity in railway network

Climate-friendly transport policies across the country require major investments in the railway network. Capacity for passenger and goods trains will be doubled. We want to build high-speed railways and link the major Swedish cities Stockholm, Gothenburg and Malmö to Copenhagen and Oslo. We also want to link the main line with regional tracks to strengthen regional connections. It will be cheaper to travel by train than drive or fly.

3. Expand public transport

We want to invest in an extensive expansion of the public transport system, trams, regional trains, underground and buses, to create more climate-friendly cities. We want to double public transport’s share of transportation by 2020. There is no need for new motorways. Public transport should be accessible and usable for people with disabilities.

4. New fuels for cars

Many people in Sweden are dependent on a car. Fossil fuels need to be phased out for environmental and cost reasons. So everyone should be given the opportunity to fill up using renewable fuel. It should be cheaper to drive on renewable fuels instead of petrol. Domestic production and distribution of renewable fuels will be encouraged. It will be possible to fill up using biogas and recharge electric cars all over the country.


5. Make your own electricity

We want to make producing your own electricity profitable. An increasing number of people are keen to invest in renewable energy and contribute to reducing their climate impact. This also means that more people should be able to supply renewable electricity to the electricity network. We want to introduce a system of fixed prices for renewable electricity and allow net metering for small-scale electricity producers.

6. Invest in renewable energy and energy efficiency

We want to replace nuclear power and fossil fuels with wind power, biofuel, wave power and solar energy, and make investments to improve energy efficiency. We want to invest in rebuilding work that leads to reduced energy consumption. This will reduce energy costs. Uranium mining will be prohibited.

7. Repair Million Programme housing

We want to introduce a special investment grant for rebuilding and repairing run-down homes and urban centres, mainly in the suburbs. The investments will lead to improved home environments and reduced energy consumption.


8. More goods by train and boat

We want to introduce a tax on HGV transportation in order to improve road safety and reduce emissions. This will mean that it will make more financial sense to transport goods by train and boat instead of lorry.

9. Protect nature and biological diversity

Meadows and pastureland that are rich in species will be protected and the section on protection of coastal areas in the Swedish Environmental Code will be strengthened. Valuable natural forests will be protected. Sweden will provide long-term protection for robust stocks of the four major predators: wolves, lynxes, bears and wolverines. The spread of environmental toxins must be curtailed, for example by banning several brominated flame retardants and hormone disruptors. We want to preserve and recreate wetlands and provide legal protection for groundwater, which are all important to our water supply.

10. Farming and animal protection

The use of pesticides and commercial fertilizer will be minimised. Animal protection will be reinforced and we want to ban fur farming. We will protect the soil. We want to make it financially viable to pursue ecologically sustainable farming. Sweden will be at the helm within green industries such as ecotourism and small-scale food processing. We want to protect the soil from genetically modified crops.

[Utopian Leftist]

76. Interesting post.

Very informative to see what another country is doing. Too bad we are stuck in the dark ages, here.

[harun]

129. +1, thanks for the post!

[Cetacea]

136. +1

[Kurovski]

145. +++++

.

[Enthusiast]

158. Where do I sign up?

Our secret cabal of RULERS are like greedy dog that sees his reflection in the water. http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dog_and_its_Reflection

They are in complete control of our lives, the electoral process and they have stolen nearly everything. They don't know the meaning of the word "enough". Their greed has no limits.

[DFW]

197. Lyckas till med allt det där

Better than Soviet style "socialism" (det var det inte verkligen), and more equitable than our present system
in the USA. Extremists never do anyone any good except themselves, and even then only until they are overthrown
by those their blind extremism oppresses.

[BulletproofLandshark]

74. .

[lutherj]

77. ++

[earcandle]

78. for the evolved....

[PuffedMica]

79. |

[PuffedMica]

161. ±

[handmade34]

80. I'm in......

[slay]

81. .

n/t

[alittlelark]

82. ...

[Overseas]

83. ...

:applause:

[susanr516]

84. .

:thumbsup:

[TBF]

85. ...

http://marxistleninist.wordpress.com/

[Vincardog]

86. .

[EvolveOrConvolve]

87. I can't stay silent

FUCK YOU, CAPITALISM. ::nuke:

[Howler]

88. ....

.....

[DRex]

89. !!!

[watajob]

90. Count me in!

:D

[slipslidingaway]

91. ...

:hi:

[pezDispenser]

92. knr

[kestrel91316]

93. ...

The older I get, the lefter I lean.

[unkachuck]

95. K&R....n/t

[SnoopDog]

96. Un-recommended..

Democratic Socialism - absolutely.
-power, healthcare, water, transportation, food


Pure socialism - no.
I don;t want the gov making my TV...

Get it?

[rhett o rick]

134. Good grief. nm

[TomClash]

99. .

[defendandprotect]

100. >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> >>>>>>>> >>>>>>>>

[RoccoR5955]

102. ...

[I hate liars]

103. +

[Duck]

104. Albert Einstein on Socialisim - please read

Is it advisable for one who is not an expert on economic and social issues to express views on the subject of socialism? I believe for a number of reasons that it is.

Let us first consider the question from the point of view of scientific knowledge. It might appear that there are no essential methodological differences between astronomy and economics: scientists in both fields attempt to discover laws of general acceptability for a circumscribed group of phenomena in order to make the interconnection of these phenomena as clearly understandable as possible. But in reality such methodological differences do exist. The discovery of general laws in the field of economics is made difficult by the circumstance that observed economic phenomena are often affected by many factors which are very hard to evaluate separately. In addition, the experience which has accumulated since the beginning of the so-called civilized period of human history has—as is well known—been largely influenced and limited by causes which are by no means exclusively economic in nature. For example, most of the major states of history owed their existence to conquest. The conquering peoples established themselves, legally and economically, as the privileged class of the conquered country. They seized for themselves a monopoly of the land ownership and appointed a priesthood from among their own ranks. The priests, in control of education, made the class division of society into a permanent institution and created a system of values by which the people were thenceforth, to a large extent unconsciously, guided in their social behavior.

But historic tradition is, so to speak, of yesterday; nowhere have we really overcome what Thorstein Veblen called “the predatory phase” of human development. The observable economic facts belong to that phase and even such laws as we can derive from them are not applicable to other phases. Since the real purpose of socialism is precisely to overcome and advance beyond the predatory phase of human development, economic science in its present state can throw little light on the socialist society of the future.

Second, socialism is directed towards a social-ethical end. Science, however, cannot create ends and, even less, instill them in human beings; science, at most, can supply the means by which to attain certain ends. But the ends themselves are conceived by personalities with lofty ethical ideals and—if these ends are not stillborn, but vital and vigorous—are adopted and carried forward by those many human beings who, half unconsciously, determine the slow evolution of society.

For these reasons, we should be on our guard not to overestimate science and scientific methods when it is a question of human problems; and we should not assume that experts are the only ones who have a right to express themselves on questions affecting the organization of society.

Innumerable voices have been asserting for some time now that human society is passing through a crisis, that its stability has been gravely shattered. It is characteristic of such a situation that individuals feel indifferent or even hostile toward the group, small or large, to which they belong. In order to illustrate my meaning, let me record here a personal experience. I recently discussed with an intelligent and well-disposed man the threat of another war, which in my opinion would seriously endanger the existence of mankind, and I remarked that only a supra-national organization would offer protection from that danger. Thereupon my visitor, very calmly and coolly, said to me: “Why are you so deeply opposed to the disappearance of the human race?”

I am sure that as little as a century ago no one would have so lightly made a statement of this kind. It is the statement of a man who has striven in vain to attain an equilibrium within himself and has more or less lost hope of succeeding. It is the expression of a painful solitude and isolation from which so many people are suffering in these days. What is the cause? Is there a way out?

It is easy to raise such questions, but difficult to answer them with any degree of assurance. I must try, however, as best I can, although I am very conscious of the fact that our feelings and strivings are often contradictory and obscure and that they cannot be expressed in easy and simple formulas.

Man is, at one and the same time, a solitary being and a social being. As a solitary being, he attempts to protect his own existence and that of those who are closest to him, to satisfy his personal desires, and to develop his innate abilities. As a social being, he seeks to gain the recognition and affection of his fellow human beings, to share in their pleasures, to comfort them in their sorrows, and to improve their conditions of life. Only the existence of these varied, frequently conflicting, strivings accounts for the special character of a man, and their specific combination determines the extent to which an individual can achieve an inner equilibrium and can contribute to the well-being of society. It is quite possible that the relative strength of these two drives is, in the main, fixed by inheritance. But the personality that finally emerges is largely formed by the environment in which a man happens to find himself during his development, by the structure of the society in which he grows up, by the tradition of that society, and by its appraisal of particular types of behavior. The abstract concept “society” means to the individual human being the sum total of his direct and indirect relations to his contemporaries and to all the people of earlier generations. The individual is able to think, feel, strive, and work by himself; but he depends so much upon society—in his physical, intellectual, and emotional existence—that it is impossible to think of him, or to understand him, outside the framework of society. It is “society” which provides man with food, clothing, a home, the tools of work, language, the forms of thought, and most of the content of thought; his life is made possible through the labor and the accomplishments of the many millions past and present who are all hidden behind the small word “society.”

It is evident, therefore, that the dependence of the individual upon society is a fact of nature which cannot be abolished—just as in the case of ants and bees. However, while the whole life process of ants and bees is fixed down to the smallest detail by rigid, hereditary instincts, the social pattern and interrelationships of human beings are very variable and susceptible to change. Memory, the capacity to make new combinations, the gift of oral communication have made possible developments among human being which are not dictated by biological necessities. Such developments manifest themselves in traditions, institutions, and organizations; in literature; in scientific and engineering accomplishments; in works of art. This explains how it happens that, in a certain sense, man can influence his life through his own conduct, and that in this process conscious thinking and wanting can play a part.

Man acquires at birth, through heredity, a biological constitution which we must consider fixed and unalterable, including the natural urges which are characteristic of the human species. In addition, during his lifetime, he acquires a cultural constitution which he adopts from society through communication and through many other types of influences. It is this cultural constitution which, with the passage of time, is subject to change and which determines to a very large extent the relationship between the individual and society. Modern anthropology has taught us, through comparative investigation of so-called primitive cultures, that the social behavior of human beings may differ greatly, depending upon prevailing cultural patterns and the types of organization which predominate in society. It is on this that those who are striving to improve the lot of man may ground their hopes: human beings are not condemned, because of their biological constitution, to annihilate each other or to be at the mercy of a cruel, self-inflicted fate.

If we ask ourselves how the structure of society and the cultural attitude of man should be changed in order to make human life as satisfying as possible, we should constantly be conscious of the fact that there are certain conditions which we are unable to modify. As mentioned before, the biological nature of man is, for all practical purposes, not subject to change. Furthermore, technological and demographic developments of the last few centuries have created conditions which are here to stay. In relatively densely settled populations with the goods which are indispensable to their continued existence, an extreme division of labor and a highly-centralized productive apparatus are absolutely necessary. The time—which, looking back, seems so idyllic—is gone forever when individuals or relatively small groups could be completely self-sufficient. It is only a slight exaggeration to say that mankind constitutes even now a planetary community of production and consumption.

I have now reached the point where I may indicate briefly what to me constitutes the essence of the crisis of our time. It concerns the relationship of the individual to society. The individual has become more conscious than ever of his dependence upon society. But he does not experience this dependence as a positive asset, as an organic tie, as a protective force, but rather as a threat to his natural rights, or even to his economic existence. Moreover, his position in society is such that the egotistical drives of his make-up are constantly being accentuated, while his social drives, which are by nature weaker, progressively deteriorate. All human beings, whatever their position in society, are suffering from this process of deterioration. Unknowingly prisoners of their own egotism, they feel insecure, lonely, and deprived of the naive, simple, and unsophisticated enjoyment of life. Man can find meaning in life, short and perilous as it is, only through devoting himself to society.

The economic anarchy of capitalist society as it exists today is, in my opinion, the real source of the evil. We see before us a huge community of producers the members of which are unceasingly striving to deprive each other of the fruits of their collective labor—not by force, but on the whole in faithful compliance with legally established rules. In this respect, it is important to realize that the means of production—that is to say, the entire productive capacity that is needed for producing consumer goods as well as additional capital goods—may legally be, and for the most part are, the private property of individuals.

For the sake of simplicity, in the discussion that follows I shall call “workers” all those who do not share in the ownership of the means of production—although this does not quite correspond to the customary use of the term. The owner of the means of production is in a position to purchase the labor power of the worker. By using the means of production, the worker produces new goods which become the property of the capitalist. The essential point about this process is the relation between what the worker produces and what he is paid, both measured in terms of real value. Insofar as the labor contract is “free,” what the worker receives is determined not by the real value of the goods he produces, but by his minimum needs and by the capitalists’ requirements for labor power in relation to the number of workers competing for jobs. It is important to understand that even in theory the payment of the worker is not determined by the value of his product.

Private capital tends to become concentrated in few hands, partly because of competition among the capitalists, and partly because technological development and the increasing division of labor encourage the formation of larger units of production at the expense of smaller ones. The result of these developments is an oligarchy of private capital the enormous power of which cannot be effectively checked even by a democratically organized political society. This is true since the members of legislative bodies are selected by political parties, largely financed or otherwise influenced by private capitalists who, for all practical purposes, separate the electorate from the legislature. The consequence is that the representatives of the people do not in fact sufficiently protect the interests of the underprivileged sections of the population. Moreover, under existing conditions, private capitalists inevitably control, directly or indirectly, the main sources of information (press, radio, education). It is thus extremely difficult, and indeed in most cases quite impossible, for the individual citizen to come to objective conclusions and to make intelligent use of his political rights.

The situation prevailing in an economy based on the private ownership of capital is thus characterized by two main principles: first, means of production (capital) are privately owned and the owners dispose of them as they see fit; second, the labor contract is free. Of course, there is no such thing as a pure capitalist society in this sense. In particular, it should be noted that the workers, through long and bitter political struggles, have succeeded in securing a somewhat improved form of the “free labor contract” for certain categories of workers. But taken as a whole, the present day economy does not differ much from “pure” capitalism.

Production is carried on for profit, not for use. There is no provision that all those able and willing to work will always be in a position to find employment; an “army of unemployed” almost always exists. The worker is constantly in fear of losing his job. Since unemployed and poorly paid workers do not provide a profitable market, the production of consumers’ goods is restricted, and great hardship is the consequence. Technological progress frequently results in more unemployment rather than in an easing of the burden of work for all. The profit motive, in conjunction with competition among capitalists, is responsible for an instability in the accumulation and utilization of capital which leads to increasingly severe depressions. Unlimited competition leads to a huge waste of labor, and to that crippling of the social consciousness of individuals which I mentioned before.

This crippling of individuals I consider the worst evil of capitalism. Our whole educational system suffers from this evil. An exaggerated competitive attitude is inculcated into the student, who is trained to worship acquisitive success as a preparation for his future career.

I am convinced there is only one way to eliminate these grave evils, namely through the establishment of a socialist economy, accompanied by an educational system which would be oriented toward social goals. In such an economy, the means of production are owned by society itself and are utilized in a planned fashion. A planned economy, which adjusts production to the needs of the community, would distribute the work to be done among all those able to work and would guarantee a livelihood to every man, woman, and child. The education of the individual, in addition to promoting his own innate abilities, would attempt to develop in him a sense of responsibility for his fellow men in place of the glorification of power and success in our present society.

Nevertheless, it is necessary to remember that a planned economy is not yet socialism. A planned economy as such may be accompanied by the complete enslavement of the individual. The achievement of socialism requires the solution of some extremely difficult socio-political problems: how is it possible, in view of the far-reaching centralization of political and economic power, to prevent bureaucracy from becoming all-powerful and overweening? How can the rights of the individual be protected and therewith a democratic counterweight to the power of bureaucracy be assured?

Clarity about the aims and problems of socialism is of greatest significance in our age of transition. Since, under present circumstances, free and unhindered discussion of these problems has come under a powerful taboo, I consider the foundation of this magazine to be an important public service.

[JackRiddler]

206. Kick for Albert E.

[SammyWinstonJack]

105. ...

[Shoedogg]

106. ...

[Critters2]

108. +1 nt

[Tashca]

109. ...

[usregimechange]

110. Nope, I support regulated capitalism, in most sectors.

[harun]

182. Oxymoron

[veness]

111. Shhhhhh. :-) n/t

[OwnedByFerrets]

112. +1

[DeSwiss]

113. .....

[Sparkly]

114. :)

[UpInArms]

115. shoulder to shoulder

[Dystopian]

116. ‡

[Lydia Leftcoast]

117. (Shhh)

...

[mirrera]

120. ..

[Zorra]

121. _^_

[nilram]

122. ...!!!...!!!...!!!

!!!

[toadzilla]

123. fuck silence. I am a socialist.

[donheld]

124. .

:thumbsup:

[rhett o rick]

135. I am not sure what I am, but I am sure I aint a capitalist. I second the fuk silence shit. nm

[Jack Rabbit]

125. ()

[Betsy Ross]

127. !

[silverlib]

130. ...

[veganlush]

132. .

.

[McCamy Taylor]

137. .....

[madinmaryland]

138. ??

:hi:

[Tikki]

139. ...

[wundermaus]

140. ...

[Yuugal]

142. K&R

Capitalism is a rich man's scam and nothing more. Enjoy your crumbs when you can get any and meanwhile stock up on the ammo.

[Marcel]

143. .

[Bozita]

146. link ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=439x950339

[grahamhgreen]

147. ^

[eridani]

148. n/t

[westerebus]

149. 1x1x1x1x1x1x1

[JoePhilly]

204. =1?

[Tracyjo]

150. ..

[Kalun D]

152. K and R

K and R

[BlueCollar]

153. ..

[byronius]

159. .

[Agent William]

160. -

[johnroshan]

162. UNREC - Socialism as a system is too dangerous. Too much power in the hands of

too few people. Just the same as unregulated capitalism like we have now. Its better to have a few key essentials socialized and the rest to function in a market based economy.

I would prefer a lightly regulated capitalistic economy, with certain basic aspects like healthcare, military, law enforcement etc.. socialized.

[laylah]

163. ...

[RedRoses323]

165. Not Saying Boo....

:toast:

[Hawkowl]

167. Power to the people

:)

[cali]

168. here's my problem with this thread and with what I see as

the somewhat reflexive reccing of it: There are a lot of visions of what socialism should look like; some I strongly endorse, others I don't.

[patrice]

195. +++++++++++++++++++

[SalmonChantedEvening]

169. .

[Speed8098]

170. +1

:fistbump:

[StopTheNeoCons]

171. ..+1

..

[mntleo2]

172. X 1000!

[poverlay]

173. ......

[Hun Joro]

175. .

[PuffedMica]

177. ≈

[mountainlion55]

178. reply 78

Zeitgeist Move Foward:toast:

[Hugabear]

179. .....

n/t

[Gorobei]

180. +

[66 dmhlt]

181. ^ ^ ^ ^ ^ ^

[MNBrewer]

183. +1

[MsLeopard]

186. .+

[Zhade]

187. \../_ _\../

(throwin' up the horns for HELL YEAH!)

[bikebloke]

189. Aye!

[Veruca Salt]

190. ....

:hi: :thumbsup:

[Joe Bacon]

192. +

Michael Harrington's spirit still lives :-)

[nolabels]

193. Peopleism

Loners can help support things too :shrug:

[thanks_imjustlurking]

194. +

[WillyT]

196. K & R !!!

:kick:

:hi:

[supernova]

199. ...

:hi:

[SalviaBlue]

200. ...

[Cascadian]

201. Better socialist than capitalist! n/t

[Octafish]

202. .

[colsohlibgal]

203. +1

Democratic Socialism > Pure Capitalism....for all but the ruling class.

[Populist_Prole]

205. Here's another............

[WatchWhatISay]

207. A democracy is probably a better idea.

Too bad we dont have one :-(

[LeftofU]

208. .

[Judi Lynn]

209. +1.

http://www.kcdemocrats.org.nyud.net:8090/KickingDonkey.jpg

[Veracious]

210. MAN is SOCIAL

Man's greatest accomplishments have come through cooperative social efforts!

[Taverner]

211. ...

|\', \.
.' \\| \'.
__| |~ \ :
/\ \_. \ /\ : |
\ \| \ \/ \ / /
\/ \ \/\ '._.' /
/\ \ '.___.'
/ /\ \
/ / \ \
/ / \ \
\/ \/

[bluestate10]

213. nt

:puke:

[malaise]

214. Kick

..

[sasquuatch55]

215. Hey Christian Conservatives..Jesus was a socialist! nt

nt

[Kitty Herder]

216. ++

:)

[Odin2005]

217. !!!

:hi:

[PuffedMica]

223. ,

[bobthedrummer]

224. ^^^

:patriot:

[crickets]

225. ...

:hi: