At this time, I don't give a crap about Mueller's investigation...

[kentuck]

It has turned into an excuse for the Senate to sit on their asses and do nothing while they wait on Bob Mueller to do something. It is a losing formula.

Because every day they do nothing, Donald Trump tears down everything that we have.

I am beginning to think we would be better off if there was no Special Counsel at all and the people we elected would have to do their job.

It is the lesson of unforeseen consequences.

[C_U_L8R]

1. They should all be chased out of restaurants

until they take action

[spanone]

2. we need the special counsel because we have a rogue 'president' and a compliant congress

[kentuck]

3. Very true but...

...I fear we do not have the time we think we have. Putin and Trump are consolidating power very rapidly.

[TrishaJ]

30. Exactly.

Since the Legislative Branch is not doing their JOB by impeaching this traitor criminal, it's now up to the Justice Department.

[fallout87]

49. The only people who can take him down is congress

Through impeachment.

Not a special counsel.

[LonePirate]

4. What exactly do you want the Senate to do? Investigate?

[sinkingfeeling]

8. +100

[kentuck]

9. How many times do you have to look under the bed to see that there is a traitor underneath?

What more do we need to see?

Maybe if he meets Putin one-on-one with no Americans allowed will do the trick? Maybe that will be enough?

What else do we need to see??

[LonePirate]

10. Again I ask, what do you want the Senate to do? Pass a resolution calling him a traitor?

[kentuck]

11. They have the power to dismiss him from office.

He has done enough damage and there is enough proof. The time for investigating is over. It is time for something to be done.

[brooklynite]

12. No-they do NOT

They have the power only to vote on an Impeachment PASSED BY THE HOUSE.

[kentuck]

14. They have the power to convict.

If they use it. It's time to use it.

[H2O Man]

16. True, but

the House would have to impeach him first. The Senate cannot convict him before that.

I do agree that the Senate could do more to slow the pace of damage that Trump is inflicting on the US and world.

[kentuck]

18. True...

But the House has been known to follow the lead of the Senate on big decisions. Whether this House would do so is another question. The House impeaches and the Senate convicts. That is the process.

[H2O Man]

24. One of the duties

of the US Senate is to inform and educate the public. I remember back in the days of the Plame scandal, another friend here disagreed with me on this. The most recent overwhelming evidence to document that I am 100% correct in this is found in the Senate Watergate Report, which in part focuses on the historic role the Senate plays in this. It is a duty that the House does not share.

The recent Senate committee report on Russian "meddling" in the 2016 election is an example of informing and educating the public. However, in the current political environment, it is evident that issuing the report is not enough. While some Senators -- including a couple of republicans -- have appeared on the news to confirm the results of the report, there is definitely a need for the entire Senate to do more. Much more. And, exactly as you note, that puts pressure on the House.

The Senate committee was tasked exclusively with investigating the Russian efforts. Hence, it did not seek to investigate the Trump campaign/administration, so as to not interfere with the investigation under Mr. Comey, and now Mr. Mueller. This decision has both positive and negative potentials, as shown during the Iran-Contra era.

As frustrating as it is, the current House will not impeach. Even when the Mueller report is issued in September, the rabid republicans will say, "But what about Hillary's e-mails?" Thus, we must do our part. That includes winning the November elections. It also must involve increasing public pressure on both Houses of Congress to impeach Trump. In other words, we share the duty to inform and educate the general public.

[kentuck]

25. I think both sides are looking for a leader...

...since no one comes forth, they follow the demagogue Trump. Somebody needs to step up and show a little courage.

Too many people are accepting the premise that nothing can be done and no one can be communicated with until Democrats win the next election. That is an admission of failure, in my opinion.

We are in a crisis and they need to be discussing solutions instead of waiting on an investigation to finish or waiting for the next election. Talk, talk, talk is better than war, war, war.

I do not accept that every Congressman and every Senator is so set in their opinions that they cannot listen to reason.

Although there is no hope for Mitch McConnell...

Sorry H2O Man....I am too pissed off today to communicate rationally.

[H2O Man]

32. I liked your idea

about a group -- even a small one -- of Senators and Representatives forming to address the absolute crisis-state that we are now in. That cannot, at this time, be the "gang of eight," because those republicans have compromised almost every ethical standard necessary. It may be that some governors have to step up and play a larger role, too.

In my opinion, it would be irrational not to feel pissed off, frustrated, and angry. So I will respectfully disagree that you are not communicating rationally.

What we are witnessing and experiencing is the rot of an empire. Throughout human history, in the age of nation-states that achieve empire status, this is the inevitable end so long as people remain unconscious. Yet with conscious, purposeful action, it is not inevitable. Everyone who gardens knows that out of compost comes new growth. Indeed, when a seed sprouts, its shell must decay and split apart. By conscious thought and action, we can make a positive germination to an improved society. Those are the only two options we have.

[appalachiablue]

44. Well said, rotting of an empire, unless there's renewal as with gardens.

[H2O Man]

46. Thank you!

[kentuck]

45. Thanks for your comments, Friend!

I have spent a good part of the day watering my garden. It's hotter than Hades here in Colorado. We usually get a little cloud cover about 2:00 pm, but not for the last 2 or 3 days. It is straight-thru summer heat.

I think I must have got up on the wrong side of bed this morning....then when I hear what Trump had said about our allies, it just pissed me off to the max.

And the idea that we have Congressmen and Senators that pretend they do not see the danger within the White House and are willing to put politics above the survival of their country is equally disturbing.

Our allies look at Donald Trump with their mouths agape, wondering why there is no check and balance on him? How could Americans simply stand by and watch this fool destroy their country when they could do something about it? Not only that, the American people are willing to stand by and watch him cozy up to the Russian dictator, all the while rupturing our relationships with our friends? It must be puzzling to them that we are such a wimpy lot?

[H2O Man]

47. Definitely!

My daughter and I spent time hauling water to our garden. It's been hot here in NY, too.

In Erich Fromm's classic "The Sane Society," he notes that sane individuals in an insane society will not only be viewed as "weird," but will be more likely to question their own thinking from time to time. It's normal to be angry with what we are witnessing. It's healthy, too.

[appalachiablue]

48. Calling Gen. Smedley Butler! We need someone like that now.

Remember how Butler had the courage & integrity not to become involved in the coup against FDR in 1933, aka 'The Business Plot.' Also to testify about it before Congress.

[lapucelle]

51. The steps of the process have a particular order.

Impeachment comes first.

[Takket]

13. Congress can impeach any time they want

They don’t need Mueller.

[kentuck]

15. Absolutely!

This is way beyond Democrat vs Republican. This is about the survival of our democracy. They are all much too silent at this time.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

55. They can, but they won't. Do you seriously think the GOP-controlled House Judiciary Committee

would send a single article of impeachment to the full House, and even if they did, that the GOP-controlled House would actually vote to impeach? And then, that 2/3 of the GOP-controlled Senate would convict? Really?

[kentuck]

56. It's possible....

I suppose?

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

57. And if my aunt had wheels she'd be a pastry cart. It's not going to happen

as long as the GOP controls both houses of Congress.

[kentuck]

58. You say that with some certainty.

[Takket]

60. Of course I don't believe that

The op was just saying he/she is basically sick of waiting for Mueller as if impeachment can only proceeed WITH his report. I was just pointing out that they don’t have to wait for him. But obviously the traitors won’t do that.

[Fullduplexxx]

5. They would be sitting on their assess doing nothing anyway . They cant govern or legislate

Imo if it werent for mueller we would be listening to them talk about how they need to investigate hillary

[shraby]

6. The senate AND house will sit on their asses anyway.

At least Mueller is investigating and will come to conclusions. Just a matter of time.

[kentuck]

7. "Just a matter of time.

Unfortunately, we don't have the time.l

[bluestarone]

21. I feel the same way BUT

unfortunately we also do not have any CHOICE! Everyone here thinks, how much proof does Mueller need? The fact is we DO NOT know or understand his investigation, so naturally we are anxious and want this bastard INDICTED!!!! I'm like you , i want this over before the supreme court can rule that RUMP cannot be indicted!! I just want SOMETHING to happen!!!!!!!!

[panader0]

17. I respectfully disagree.

We need Mueller and his investigation more than ever. I just wish he could
move a bit quicker, although I'm sure he's being thorough. When the new set of
indictments come out, we'll all be celebrating.

[kentuck]

20. Flynn went before the judge only yesterday.

At this rate, Russia will end the investigation when they take complete control.

[FM123]

27. "At this rate, Russia will end the investigation when they take complete control"

13 of the most ominous words on this thread!

[onecaliberal]

28. The investigation will and because of the new guy overseeing it.

[Nitram]

19. Your impatience is understandable, kentuck, but you haven't proposed a better alternative.

Trump and his conservative allies win if we don't let this play out as required by our laws and the constitution. Living through 8 years of the Reagan administration and 8 years of the George W. Bush administration tried my patience to the breaking point. But we did get through them intact.

[kentuck]

22. We got thru them....

"Intact" is debatable.

I am beyond impatient. I am pissed off! We cannot make it to the end of this investigation at this rate. These traitors will be held to account!

[AlexSFCA]

23. false equivalence

those were peanuts compared to what’s happening now. They both would be considered liberal in today’s environemnt. Reagan even got away with amnesty. Those were patriots whether we agree with them or not, they treated allies well and tried to protect liberal democracies across the globe. Trump is actively working against US interests, weakening national security. There is no comparison. Also, isn’t reagan’s SC appointees Sandra O’Connor and Kennedy were definately better than Bush W and trump’s selections.

[Nitram]

40. Alex, I agree that Trump is exponentially worse than Reagan and Bush.

My point is that we will survive this if we keep our heads and don't let anger and impatience cloud our judgement. Mueller is our best hope for bringing Trump and his minions down in a way that will have lasting effects for our democratic system. But Mueller's investigation won't man a thing of Democrats don't get out and vote in a majority of Dems in both houses of Congress. I never thought we'd see the light at the end of the tunnel during Reagan's administration. He made changes that led straight to Trump's election.

[AlexSFCA]

41. you are putting too much trust in Mueller

It is naive to assume that his findings will have a lasting impact. Even if he proof collusion with Putin by that time Russia becomes our closes ally. With the fundamental weakening of our national security, God only knows what lies ahead for US soil. I think the best is just focus on November right now and block any negativity for which we’ll have plenty of time should we fail.

[Nitram]

42. Our democracy is stronger than Putin and Trump.

It's not Henny Penny time yet.

[Afromania]

26. I hear ya buddy, but the fact of the matter is that this congress isn't going to do jack.

Without Muelller I doubt they'd do any real investigation into this mess. It would just be a sham shit show and they'd say nothing happened by way of technicality to give legitimacy to this fraudulent administration. The way things shook out we have to play the long game so that when we put the republican party down that fuckers stays down.

Unfortunately the mess that's going on would still be going on if Mueller wasn't investigating. What needs to happen is we need to continue to resist the normalization of anybody associated with how this is all going down. They thought they were going to grind us all down but instead it's fortifying our resolve. Don't let them get you down because when history shakes this shit out there are going to be certifiable villains and cataloged traitors to this country; they will all be republican and it will keep the modern republican party dead in it's grave.

[stopbush]

29. If Mueller wasn't investigating the Senate Rs would simply find another

pretense to do nothing. That’s how Rs operate.

[peggysue2]

31. Anyone watching this ongoing disaster is . . .

out of patience and pissed. But expecting the current House and Senate with Republican majorities to 'do something' or stop the Trumpster's worst instincts is an exercise in spitting in the wind.

I mean come on, Ken, the GOP allowed this wanna-be dictator into the tent willingly. They've supported and bowed with an obsequiousness to the Trumpster that is absolutely sickening. They are purposeful enablers and have attempted to buck Mueller's investigation at every damn turn. Many of them, I suspect, are compromised themselves with dark money and Russian oligarch/lobbying connections.

Mueller has a job to do and we have no influence on how fast or slow the investigation proceeds. We as members of the Democratic Party have our job to do in November--sweep the elections, throw the traitors out of office and begin repairing the damage while neutering the Trumpster's destructive impulses.

We're wa-a-ay beyond expectations of congressional responsibility and accountability because the players are holding the country hostage and are not acting in good faith.

We are the minority party at the moment, so our reach is limited in what we can accomplish. We have a shot at changing that in less than 4 months.

One shot. We dare not miss.

There's simply no frigging time for woe is me or pissing on the only investigation of import.

We want to see things change? We march to the polls en masse in November. We vote for every damn Democrat on the ballot. Everywhere. We win, and then we put our shoulders together and get to work.

That's how we turn this around.

[tosh]

33. Excellent post!

And, THANK YOU, peggysue2, I really needed to hear this right now as my morale has been at a low spot this week.

[kentuck]

34. "One shot. We dare not miss."

...and what if we do miss and Repubs keep both House and Senate? What then?

[peggysue2]

38. Then all bets are off

Which is why we cannot afford to fail in November, why all our energy and passion has to be directed toward one result and one result only: a smashing, incontrovertible victory.

We can do this, Ken. Because we must.

[kentuck]

39. I wish everyone felt the same as you about voting ...

...but I have lost a lot of faith in Democratic voters lately. We have no idea if can get them to the polls or not. Some are just beat down and some are just fat and lazy. They don't seem to care if we lose everything that so many have fought and died for. I hope people get out and vote but I'm not holding my breath. I pray I am proven wrong .

[NY_20th]

37. Excellent post.

Thank you.

[Va Lefty]

43. This post!

v

[JustABozoOnThisBus]

35. The Senate would rather investigate Hillary's emails. Or Benghazi. Forever. nt

[JI7]

36. HAHAHAHA , you think republicans will investigate if there was no mueller ?

[Garrett78]

50. The investigation could go on for many years. Far simpler investigations have lasted for years.

[The Velveteen Ocelot]

52. They'd still be sitting on their asses. The only way anything can happen

is still through Mueller's investigation.

[MadDAsHell]

53. I was a lurker for Fitzmas, I know how this movie ends...

Same story, different year. Tempt us with clickbait for a year or more, give us disappointment and embarrassment in the end. From Starr to Mueller, Special Counsels are a joke.

[Hoyt]

59. No joke. I'd wake up several times at night to see if Fitzgerald lowered boom on bush/Cheney.

In end, absolutely nothing, zero. I hope this is different, but not counting on it. We need to vote like hell in November if we want to neuter trump.

[Snackshack]

54. Rome...

Was a true republic for almost ~700 yrs before the first emperor. We made it to ~240 yrs.