Reply #171: Seems it became a flamefest after all. A pity. [View All]

[Deja Q]

:(

Your question IS valid as we still live in countries where, when immigrating to them, we have to pass any number of tests in order to become an immigrant.

And, again, to leave one's "home" country for another rather speaks volumes about one's loyalty to the country they're fleeing. So, yeah, why wave the flag of the country they chose to leave in favor of another they decided was better... rather than stay and clean up their country's mess themselves?

Bingo. Loyalty. Or, rather, the lack of it? America has enough self-serving Libertarians as it is. We don't need anymore. We need America's infrastructure to become strong again, so we can properly trade with other countries and end the trade deficit problem. And "guest workers" has no impact on that either way as the jobs are almost entirely service-related, not manufacturing or engineering. (not that service is a bad thing, most of us are in service type jobs as we shifted to a service-based economy during the 1980s and 1990s... but I digress.)

They are as loyal to the US as the country they came from and would leave us in an attosecond if they felt they'd be treated better elsewhere. I thought the US would want to welcome people to help strengthen it. (so all this speaks volumes about the "guest worker" changes about to take place... yipes. Is America truly being dismantled, using programs that Liberals would love... because the same programs will be turned against them come election years? And despite it all, the fact the Repubs are just as divided should be through provoking too!)


I'm saddened by race has become an issue. Very feeble, to say the least. It isn't about race at all. All along, it's been about national loyalty and fighting exploitation, which is the next best thing to slavery and I'm shocked how many DUers, in support of this "guest worker" flim-flam fracus, have nary a care about exploitation - or otherwise must be in full support of it, which is a pretty disgusting thought too.

And, like I've been saying, if I emigrated to the United Kingdom, studied, passed, became a legal citizen... then went into a protest and waved the US flag all around... It makes the UK leadership bad. It makes me look pretty bad as waving the US flag shows I'd rather parade support for a country I left than the country I purportedly pledged loyalty too. (thinking of situations from the others' point of view is a useful technique and I've done so for posts I disagreed with. I'm not as hardlined on the issue, but I still need to keep reality and those cozy charming dreams separated.)

I'd rather see immigrants come here to contribute and be paid justly for their contributions; which in turn makes them happier to BE Americans, which means they will be loyal in times of need. That's the mindset most of us grew up with (even for our own natural-born citizens) or most of us fathomed is how any civilized country ought to be ran. Not spat on by a bunch of snake oil salesmen who'd get anyone to work for half a pittance if possible. and not possessed by Ayn Rand garbage that's tantamount to anarchy, which does nobody any good at all. Nature ahbors a vacuum, and its epicenter is in her mind. (well, half-garbage. It sure as hell is okay to be an individual and respect how other people live their lives; that's Constitutional to the core. But she goes well outside the realm of rationality, but that's another topic in its own right...)

Whatever. I've said my argument and have read enough posts on the topic.

As for the Native American, Columbus, and other aspects... the past is the past and how much more convulted must the topic become just for the sake of empty politics and nostalgia? The here and now is what is important. The past is the past. Gotta start somewhere. Or else not bother at all.