Wiccan priestess fired Claims time off for religious holidays cost her job

[Tuttle]

Wiccan priestess fired
Claims time off for religious holidays cost her job

<snip>
My troubles began when I asked for my religious holidays off without pay, said Folberth, who said the technical reason she was given for the firing was job performance.

She said she will get an attorney and pursue a lawsuit. In the meantime, though, she used her circumstance to get the message out that Connecticut needs legislation providing unpaid religious days off in the workplace.

Christians, Jews, Muslims, and all other religions with numerous lesser-known holidays would benefit from the law as much as any Wiccan, Folberth said.

<snip>

Wiccans, for example, have roughly eight significant holidays, such as the upcoming Vernal Equinox, called Ostara. Days off for lesser-known religious holidays are OK at some companies, as long as the employee doesn't expect to be paid, the aid said.

<snip>

more here:

http://www.connpost.com/news/ci_2608453

Tut-tut

[noonwitch]

1. She couldn't take vacation days for her holidays?

That's what my jewish coworkers do.

[vptpt]

3. That's just not fair

Christians don't have to burn vacation days to take Christmas off. Why should anyone else have to waste vacation time on their own religion's holidays?

[seriousstan]

9. Christmas is a federal holiday

You can have a problem with it, but it is the fact.

[mutus_frutex]

17. Then it shouldn't be a holiday.

Either you give it for everybody or you don't.

Personally I don't give a shit about christmas. I would rather take that day some other time of my choice if that was possible.

[AnnInLa]

2. Can someone explain to me

exactly what the words Pagan and Wiccan mean? And what do these people do? When we (Dem meetup group) were holding some visibility events, some local Pagans came out and participated by holding up signs to the passing motorists. I didn't have time to talk to any of them tho. Where do they stand politically, or do they stand at all? Thanks.

[Solon]

4. Pagan is a "catch all term"

that applies to more than one religion or belief system. Mostly these are religions based in part on beliefs and rituals from Pre-Christian Europe. Wicca is a specific religion that nominally belongs to this group. Wicca was formed back in the 1950s, based, in part, on some ancient sources in Pre-Christian Europe, along with some 19th century Thelemic influences and Celtic symbology or holidays. To give an example, Wiccans, such as myself, celebrate the Winter Solstice, usually on Dec. 22-23, about 2 to 3 days off from Christmas. We base our religion on the one celebrated before Christianity was given a foot hold in Europe. More complete explaination at this site:

http://www.religioustolerance.org/witchcra.htm

[ashmanonar]

7. "pagan" was originally an old old term

used by the romans to describe what we would call "hillbillies" or "rednecks", the people in the backcountry who worshipped the old gods and the nature gods.

i'd say wiccans and pagans are pretty conservation-minded. (IOW, liberal) although i've heard of conservative pagans. it's not the norm, but there's nothing that's really normal in the world.

[HEIL PRESIDENT GOD]

10. Yes--Latin paganus = "village dweller"

It's one of those originally derogatory words that people now use proudly. But the urban, Jupiter-worshipping Roman would be "pagan" to their Christian descendants. The "urbs" or "civitas" stopped being literally a city and meaning the mostly rural Christian civilization. Pagan came to mean outside the Christian world, and it generally means a polytheist. I have never seen the Muslims referred to as pagans, though they are often "heathens".

I tend to think of myself as a heathen.

As to Wiccans Bush started a big flap with them in the 2000 campaign, you may recall. "Witchcraft is not a religion..." I think Gore might have won based on that comment. A margin's worth of Wiccans nationwide possibly migrated from Nader due to Bush's insensitivity.

[VelmaD]

5. Like most religions there are a wide variety of beliefs among...

pagans and wiccans. For wiccans the basic philosophies are the Rule of 3 - "what you do returns to you 3fold" and the Rede - "and as it harm none, do what you will".

Pagan is a much broader term however that covers many different belief systems.

Try http://www.witchvox.com for some basics on wicca and paganism.

[ozone_man]

16. The pagan in me thanks you

for the cool links. If I could ever be said to have religion, it would be a nature based religion.

[crossroads]

22. Amen to that Brother!

[AnnInLa]

6. Thanks for the explanations and websites. n/t

[LibertyLover]

8. Wiccan priestess fired

This story bothers me. The company Ms. Folberth worked for will probably use the old excuse of poor job performance as the reason for firing her. Why they would continue employing her for 7 years and only discover her poor performance when she asked to take unpaid leave is, of course, something that will not be looked into. A friend of mine is a graphics designer and she works a lot of unpaid overtime, something which I imagine Ms. Folberth did as well. If that is the case, I honestly don't see the problem with her employer granting a day here and there as comp time.

I agree with Ms. Folberth - she probably was fired because of her request for time off to celebrate the holidays of her minority religion - but she will have an uphill battle trying to prove it and in the end probably never will. I wish her the best of luck, both with her attempt and with finding a new job in the very near future.

[Tuttle]

11. I worked with a guy who practiced wiccan

He was constantly ostrasized and ridiculed - but he is still there (I think) and I'm not...

Tut-tut

[CatFelyne]

15. Re: Wiccan priestess fired

It's things like this that make me keep my pentacle to myself.

Rev. Folberth runs a nonprofit pagan organization which functions as an incorporated church, I also belong to.
Because of all the work she does for the organization, and in the community, I'm surprised she hasn't asked for time off sooner. She's an amazing person, and I give her a lot of credit.

One shouldn't have to pay a high price for freedom of religion. Unfortunately, under this administration, I don't expect things to change. Pagans/Wiccans can't even get a VA headstone of their own. After all, since Bush doesn't think witchcraft is a religion, it's going to be hard for an individual to get any protection from this kind of bigotry.

Rev. Folberth has a large pagan community here in CT supporting her, and many others as well. Hopefully all this media exposure helps her find work, and not hinder her efforts.

Panthean Temple/Pagan Community Church:
www.pagancommunitychurch.org

[Tuttle]

21. wow - welcome CatFelyne!

Interesting that you are so well acquainted with this person and her organization - what a coincidence!

Tut-tut

[Red State Rebel]

12. As a small business owner, I see this as a disaster waiting to happen

How are you going to verify someones religion? What if they take all the Wiccan holidays then decide to switch to Judaism and take more?

I can't operate my business if the employees aren't there, whether they are being paid or not.

Would it come down to hiring people based on what religion they claim they are so you suffer less absenteeism?

[LizW]

19. What about this

Why couldn't you tell people when you are hiring that you give X number of unpaid days off for religious observance, whatever their religion may be. You won't be hit with unexpected requests for days off, and if it's not enough for the person to observe his/her religion, they have the option of not taking the job.

Personally, I think 2 days off a year for religious holidays is sufficient, but I am not religious. Many businesses give Christmas and New Years Day without going under.

Of course, I guess a Pagan could argue that if you close on Sundays, you are effectively giving 52 unpaid religious days off a year. Compared to that, 8 doesn't seem like much.

[Sivafae]

13. I thought that the x-tians in congress got a law

passed that dealt with this very issue. I think that a person has the right request an unpaid day for religous purposes, and that right is granted by the federal gov't. It was created for the Jews, but could be used by all. Or am I mistaken in that belief?

[rinsd]

14. That's what vacation days are for...

Most companies don't have off for Christian holidays beyond Christmas which is a federal holiday.

For instance, I don't have off for Lent or Good Friday.

[athenap]

20. Many companies

don't specify what the PTO (paid time off) is classified as. You get x number of days to use for vacation, sick, religious, visiting Aunt Martha, or the Star Trek marathon on Sci-Fi channel.

However, unpaid leave sometimes can create a problem - unpaid leave gets classified into leaves of absence, or short or long term disability, or other extenuating circumstances (like military duty or educational enrichment).

But the fact that this company fired the woman, and cited that universal catch all of "poor performance" stinks like something rotten in Denmark. It's very hard to prove or disprove "poor performance" as being a legitimate reason for dismissal. I hope at the very least, the attention she'll draw to the company via a lawsuit will make it think really hard about the message that sends about how much it values its employees.

[mutus_frutex]

18. This is similar to the muslims that worked for Dell..

That story was lying around for a while here and I got a lot of flak for saying that entities should have the right to discriminate when religious beliefs affect performance or go against an entity's aim.

That is the only way to protects the religious beliefs, or lack thereof, of any entity.

[VegasWolf]

23. My girlfriends always have accused me of being a pagan animal. n/t