Brussels trade war with US looms over biofuel

[CHIMO]

Source: The Guardian

Peter Mandelson, the European commissioner, has fired the first salvo in a potential transatlantic trade war by agreeing to challenge the US over its biofuel subsidies, which are chasing British and continental firms out of business.

Confidential documents seen by the Guardian show that Mandelson and the European commission have put their signatures to anti-dumping complaints lodged by the European Biodiesel Board.

Washington will be asked this week to answer allegations that subsidies amounting to 11p a litre on B99 exports from the US, plus "splash-and-dash" operations being conducted through the US, represent unfair competition.

Industry figures who asked not to be named said they were "delighted" that their allegations that US biodiesel was being dumped on the European market were being taken up by Brussels. "This is a huge step forward for us," said a producer. "It opens the way for us to finally put to an end practices that are contrary to the rules of the World Trade Organisation."



Read more: http://www.guardian.co.uk/environment/2008/may/26/biofuels.energy

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Biofuels. One big scam.

[smoochy]

1. Great!

Great news!

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

2. So, if this escalates, will we see the following headline?^

"US trade war with Brussels sprouts"

[CHIMO]

3. Perhaps

Or.

Brussel sprouts produce copious amounts of methane, overwhelming the carbonate results.

[ohio2007]

7. That's a good one Dirtbag nt

[harmonicon]

4. biofuels are not a scam!!

Still, stories like this sicken me, because most international trade is a scam. You're putting the blame in the wrong place. I see one of the great prospects of biofuels being the creation of local fuel sources, helping local economies. It's ridiculous to ship these fuels all over the world - they should be consumed near where they are produced. I think that is the main advantage of them over older fuel sources.

[CHIMO]

5. Perhaps

From that point of view it is not a scam.

Look at the total energy from bio-fuels. The most energy that can be obtained, is if it is burned as a raw product and all the energy converted into usefull purposes.

Just think. If all the producers used their bio-fuels to produce bio-fuels. How much would be left over and how much carbon dioxide would have been produced in the process.

Bio-diesel may be a usefuel alternative source of fuel, as in most cases it is a bi-product or waste product.

But I have yet to see a comprehensive study that shows bio-fuel as reducing carbon dioxide production.

Every sugar molecule that is converted to ethanol produces carbon dioxide. Haven't seen any recognition of this fact.

Local fuel sources, yes. But that does not stop our production of an insulation blanket around earth.

[harmonicon]

6. I don't think carbon dioxide reduction is the point

If that's what you're after, it's a dead end street. Whatever fuels are used, we have to use less of it. I do think that using biofuels could help in that regard (saving all of the fuel used to shit it all over the world). I would just rather have the money that's spent on gas going to a local farmers' co-op than some gigantic multinational oil corporation, or some OPEC country.

[cstanleytech]

8. Are not a large % of the farms these days though owned by

large corporations?

[harmonicon]

9. I don't know percentages

I do know that some ethanol producers are small operations, in some cases run as coops owned by the farmers who produce the grain that they then turn into ethanol. Even if many farms are corporate owned, the price of grain is set by the commodities market, and being able to sell that grain to a local ethanol plant for a high price benefits the family farmer as well.

[cstanleytech]

10. Well yeah I am sure the high price helps some farmers but isn't

it costing the poor and disabled of which there are more of more money to just feed themselves?

[harmonicon]

11. I don't think so

I think that's really a load of crap foisted upon us to turn the public against anything but imported crude oil. I remember a farmer interviewed on the BBC a few years ago saying that if the farmers were paid double for their grain, it would only add 8 cents to the price of a loaf of bread. Maybe it is a problem in other countries, and I know that the demand for production is increasing deforestation in Brazil, but on a national level in the US, I don't think it has a lot to do with the increased food prices. I suspect that the increased fuel costs, driven by the big oil companies, has far more to do with it.

[cstanleytech]

13. I'll grant you the oil price is causing the majority of the increase in price

though I dont buy the who argument fully about the cost of grain being made an issue in order to turn people away from biofuels and towards oil instead but I cant rule it out either.

[MJJP21]

14. Correction

I just wanted to clear up your statement regarding biofuel as being mainly produced from waste. At this point that is not the case. Hopefully someday that will be the reality. Biofuel is being produced primarily from food crops which is causing food prices to rise and food shortages are occurring in some parts of the world because the surplus is now being used for fuel. Using biofuel at this point, in my opinion is a negative endeavor.

[JBear]

16. I disagree...

Many bio-fuel manufacturers are using the waste stream of oils to produce. Locally we are seeing waste veg oil, rendered chicken grease and other oils going into the bio-diesel stream. This is not removing any food product from the plate. These are all feedstocks that would either be burned off or sequestered in landfills.

One other point about bio-fuels is that carbon is not created or destroyed. It is transformed from form to form. The serious increase in carbon in our atmosphere is from pumping it up from underground. Bio-based fuels do put carbon dioxide in the air, but that is "current carbon." Current carbon is carbon taken from the air, used to create bio-mass, and then re-released into the air when it is burned or fermented or rotted down. It is important to look at the whole cycle to see how this works.

:bounce:

[Grinchie]

12. Only if your stupid enough to be addicted to the Internal Combustion Engine

[JBear]

15. The problem is...

that these "local" companies are seeing big $$$ with the export of biofuels to Europe. Our local biodiesel coop has just raised its price to $5.00/gallon because they "can't keep up the supply." The reason they can't keep up is not the huge number of users, but that their capacity is largely going to Europe and not back into the local economy/air.

Big $$$ corrupts.

:popcorn: :bounce:

[ohio2007]

17. With a weak dollar vs Euro, no wonder they are gobbling it up at a bargain price

[harmonicon]

18. exactly, international trade is the real problem

If we went back to having reasonable tariffs and subsidies based on the notion of parody, we'd be in a much better place. That goes for the whole world. Maybe a law should be passed forbidding the export of domestically produced fuel sources, with some clause that exportation would only be allowed when all importation has stopped and we have a domestic surplus over X amount. Yeah, it doesn't seem like it will ever happen, but it seems sensible to me. Fair trade, not free trade is what's needed.