Questions about Bin Laden

[rumguy]

Would he and his followers have come after us if we had pulled our troops out of Saudi Arabia after the first gulf war, or would the I/P conflict and other issues have made the current conflict with Al Queda inevitable?

Did Bin Laden ever feel any gratitude for U.S. help in Afghanistan fighting the Soviets?

[buddy22600]

1. Nope if you look at Extreme, extreme Islam

The US is the great satan, while the former ussr was the lesser satan.

They would have come after us anyway

[radwriter0555]

3. Maybe you should read more about the positions of bin laden, but NOT

from the silly sources like don rumsfeld or the CIA.

they aren't exactly very credible people.

A little independent research is in order, not that it's relevent; bin laden died in December 2001.

[rumguy]

5. you got proof of that?

from a credible source

[Abe Linkman]

2. Depends on what you mean

I don't know what I/P is (why not just say, or is it so common that everyone should know? if so, my apology - but I sure don't).

bin Laden was/is a CIA asset. There is no credible evidence that "he and his followers have come after us".

He was visited by the CIA station chief in the Dubai, in August 2001, and CBS reported he was in a military hospital in Rawalpundi, Pakistan, on September 10, 2001.

bin Laden may have been "turned" into a Patsy - a modern day Lee Harvey "Patsy" Oswald.

[rumguy]

4. he's on tape admitting to it

you wondered to far into tinfoil land

[theboss]

6. It's hard to say

Bin Laden's grievances are so general and his theology so medieval that it's hard to say who exactly he hates most and what exactly his immediate goals are.

You have to take a step back. Bin Laden's ideology was forges into during the Soviet invasion of Afghanistan. (Ignore this he is a CIA plant stuff; that's such an exagerration). His main issue was that the USSR was a secular, godless state trying to impose its worldview in a Muslim World. I think this eventually morphed into the entire West (USSR, Europe, USA, Australia, etc) were all godless states trying to impose their will on the Muslim World. Though at the time, he was more than happy to use the help of the US in holding back the Soviets (who weren't defeated so much as simply exhausted in trying to hold Afghanistan, which may later be repeated by us in Iraq).

I think what Bin Laden took from the Soviet retreat was that the West was weak. The USSR had won, but was too weak spiritually to maintain it's victory. He was weak military but had Allah. I also think he saw himself as being instrumental in the total collapse of the USSR (which he very well might have been).

Over the next few years, I think he became more radicalized and wanted to impose his brand of Islam on all the Muslim world, which meant that Saudi Arabia, Iraq, Lybia, etc were also his enemies. I think his real hatred was for the Royal Family in SA at this point. And I think that was transferred to the US when we stationed troops in the kingdom during and after the Gulf War. And I think he was pissed that the US humiliated a Muslim country (even if he hated that government.

Basically I think Bin Laden's philosophy is a tower of hate. I think the Saudis were at the top of the list until they let the Americans inot the Holy Land.

So, he probably would have focussed on Saudi Arabia before the US. But of course, if Saudi Arabia went up in an Islamic Revolution, we probably would have intervened anyway and he would have been gone after the US eventually.

Bin Laden could give a shit about the Palestinians. He never mentioned them until after 9/11. He clearly hates Israel, but that's just for existing in the first place. A I/P peace plan would do little to appease him because Israel would still be there. He does recognize the PR value of the Palestinians though.