A POLL: How Many Angels Can Dance On The Head Of A Pin?

[Itsthetruth]

This is a tough one to answer with precision. I did discover an attempt to answer this question in a "scientific" paper devoted to this most important matter:

"We derive upper bounds for the density of angels dancing on the point of a pin. It is dependent on the assumed mass of the angels, with a maximum number of 8.6766*10exp49 angels at the critical angel mass (3.8807*10exp-34 kg).

One of the first reported attempts at a quantum gravity treatment of the angel density problem that also included the correct end of the pin was made by Dr. Phil Schewe. He suggested that due to quantum gravity space is likely not infinitely divisible beyond the Planck length scale of 10exp-35 meters. Hence, assuming the point of the pin to be one Ångström across (the size of a scanning tunnelling microscope tip) this would produce a maximal number of angels on the order of 1050 since they would not have more places to fill.<1>

Assuming that each angel contains at least one bit of information (fallen / not fallen), and that the point of the pin is a sphere of diameter of an Ångström (R=10exp-10 m) and has a total mass of M=9.5*10exp-29 kilograms (equivalent to that of one iron atom), we can use the Bekenstein bound<3> on information to calculate an upper bound on the angel density. In a system of diameter D and mass M, less than kDM distinguishable bits can exist, where k=2.57686*10exp43 bits/meter kg.<7> This gives us a bound of just 2.448*10exp5 angels, far below the Schewe bound.

Note that this does not take the mass of angels into account. A finite angel mass-energy would increase the possible information density significantly. If each angel has a mass m, then the Bekenstein bound gives us N<kD(M+Nm). Beyond mcrit>1/kD ¼3.8807*10exp-34 kg this produces an unbounded maximal angel density as each angel contributes enough mass-energy to allow the information of an extra angel to move in, and so on.

If the angels dance very quickly and in the same direction, then the angular momentum could lead to a situation like the extremal Kerr metric, where no event horizon forms (this could also be achieved by charging the angels).<4> Hence the number of dancing angels that can crowd together is likely much higher than the number of stationary angels.

Anyone understand this aaahhhhh .... scientific explanation?

How many angels have you observed dancing on the head of a pin or other object? Information you can provide would be greatly appreciated.

[immoderate]

1. Doesn't this belong in LBN?

:eyes:

--IMM

[Itsthetruth]

2. Late Breaking News?

I don't think so unless someone can find a hot news release from Falwell or the Vatican.

:)

[mcscajun]

3. A friend of mine shared this with me once...

...he works with developmentally disabled and emotionally disturbed teenagers.

When this question came up one day, one of the teens said to him, deadly serious: "As many as are there."

[Book Lover]

4. That is in fact the correct answer

"All of them" is the right response. The things you learn after 12 years of Catholic school...

[mcscajun]

6. I put my time in Catholic School...

...I don't recall it ever coming up. :shrug:

[Book Lover]

13. What can I say?

I had Charities, OSA, and Sisters of St Joseph. Maybe it was one of the Augustinians who brought it up...

[mcscajun]

15. Oh yeah! That'd be just like 'em.

:) The Augustinians, that is.

[KittyWampus]

5. What A Great Answer!

[The Whiskey Priest]

7. How many can dance on a pinhead

I mean a pinhead....

[Debi]

8. Why do you hate America

:cry:

[solinvictus]

9. Why not have a CNN or NBC-Dateline special on it?

That way, we can know for certain.

[mcscajun]

16. Nah...this kinda stuff is the purview of the History Channel.

:rofl:

[shockra]

10. 3.14159265358...

Pi.

Because a pinhead is round.

Because angels and pi are transcendental.

[KamaAina]

11. 25

I'm thinking of the now-Los Angeles Angels of Anaheim (?!), who got their obligatory White House visit after the 2002 World Series.

Oh, wait a minute, that's "How many Angels can dance with a pinhead?" Sorry about that. :-)

[sundancekid]

14. oh thank you for a totally hearty LOL on your post ... angels & pinhead!

:applause:

[bleedingheart]

12. We can dance if we want to, we can leave your friends behind

'Cause your friends don't dance and if they don't dance
Well they're no friends of mine

Say, we can go where we want to, a place that they will never find
And we can act like we come from out of this world
Leave the real one far behind

And we can dance

We can go when we want to, the night is young and so am I
And we can dress real neat from our hats to our feet
And surprise them with the victory cry

Say, we can act if we want to, if we don't nobody will
And you can act real rude or totally removed
And I can act like an imbecile


Say we can dance, we can dance
Everything's out of control
We can dance, we can dance
They're doing it from pole to pole
We can dance, we can dance
Everybody look at your hands
We can dance, we can dance
Everybody taken the chance

The safety dance
The safety dance
The safety dance

We can dance if we want to, we've got all your life and mine
As long as we abuse it we are never going to lose it
And everything will work out right

Say, we can dance if we want to, we can leave your friends behind
'Cause your friends don't dance and if they don't dance
well they're no friend of mine