People will disagree, but Kerry can win in '08 with just eight words...

[Rosco T.]

"I warned you... now, let's fix this mess"

[Dr Ron]

1. It will be interesting to see if Kerry does benefit

from an anti-Bush backlash.

This assumes that people both realize how many of our problems are due to Bush and his cronies, and realize that Kerry was right on the issues (rather than believing the distorted views of Kerry's positions whcih were attacked by the Republicans).

[brettdale]

12. There will be No Bush Backlash

The repugs will Blame Clinton for the mess, and the media will agree.

[iconoclastNYC]

23. You are correct except.

I agree, no Bush backlash.

This isn't about Bush, this is about the Republican party, the Republican party inflicted Bush on the country by nominating him, the Republican party is infected with a sickness, a cancer, and the Republican party will pay the price for years to come at the polls.

Bush was a symptom, Republcan corruption is the sickness, and it need about 18-30 years of chemotherapy.

[Massacure]

139. Bush had 8 years. The republican congress has 6+.

They can't blame it on Clinton forever.

[Borgnine]

2. I don't think people like to be told they were wrong.

That's why so many people claim they would still vote for Bush even though they know how bad he is. They don't want to admit they made a mistake.

[elehhhhna]

108. Plus he can't say just 8 words, when 500 will do.

[tuvor]

3. The I-told-you-so president?

I guess I'm one of those people disagreeing with you. :)

[jdj]

4. a good bumper sticker would be " I finally have something in common with

George Bush...now we BOTH wish John Kerry had won the election.

[FreedomAngel82]

15. LOL

I love it. :D

[sandnsea]

5. Let bygones be bygones, there's work to be done

I thought "There's work to be done" would have won in 2004. People are desperate to fix this country.

[BlueIris]

69. Oooh, I like that.

Classic Clinton.

[kerrygoddess]

142. Classic smart thinking!

And right!

[BlueIris]

153. Hey, now. I wasn't suggesting JK wouldn't be using his own idea

there, or drawing from his own individual and often "classic" opinion of what will work best, but pointing out that this was the heart of Clinton's best representation of his best qualities: Why elect/keep me, despite bipartisan controversy and doubt? I work hard for the American people. One of the things I love the most about Kerry is that he knows what worked for the presidents of the past, including Clinton, and he knows what will work best for him, and has molded his approach from a harmonious blending of individual vision influenced by a keen sense of history. Not everything about even master Republican-fighter Clinton was entirely wonderful, including a couple of mistakes even he admits were major screw-ups no matter what spin you put on them. ::cough:: don'taskdon'ttell ::cough:: My (second) favorite Kerry move from the campaign was Kerry's polite but firm rejection of Bill Clinton's advice that he not only continue promoting the civil union solution to the question of gay marriage, but come out in favor of at least one of the proposed same-sex marriage bans on the state ballots last fall. Nice one, Kerry. In my humble opinion, that was bad advice. Bill must have been having an "off-night" when he came up with that one.

[loybay]

6. Al Gore might have the same argument

especially since he won in 2000.

[tabasco]

115. I hope you saw Gore's speech the other day.

It was truly Presidential.

It made me especially sad seeing that poor excuse for a leader last night, as I contrasted Bush with the intelligent and inspiring Gore.

[KaliTracy]

7. I don't think that would be a way to win the hearts and minds of those

who are already mad at themselves... and for the ones that are clueless -- they wouldn't know what he warned them about...

[TriMetFan]

8. Kerry can win in 08, but he should say:

"O.k. America let fix this mess"

[FreedomAngel82]

16. I agree

I like that a little better. Or "let's work together now to get back on the right track." My question is in 2008 will more people vote democratic or go for the new republican canidate? (especially if it's McCain)

[politicasista]

9. Shhhh! You may p- -s off other DUers

:hi:

[Rosco T.]

10. I specifically didn't say "I-told-you-so..." but find something..

else for the first half of the phrase and the effect is the same...

maybe "we were warned..."

[brettdale]

11. the repugs will win again in 2008 with eight small words

Hey Karl can you rig the election again?

[Elwood P Dowd]

20. They will only rig the election if it's close

If the polls are going something like 51-39-10 against them, they will let us win. Then they will mount a multi-million dollar campaign against the incumbent democrat. The churches and board rooms will be collecting a fortune, and the Arkansas Project will look like small change in comparison.

[LittleClarkie]

65. Indeed, impeachment proceedings will begin

on Day two of the next Dem president's term.

[babylonsister]

13. My first post in awhile, but I adore

John Kerry. In the past few years I got really concerned. He sealed the deal for me.

[AlmightyTallest]

14. Too true

I have a feeling by the time 08 rolls around you could assemble an entire documentary about how Kerry was right. (Of course I'm still pessemistic about our chances of actually having elections in 08 at the rate we're going....)

[LiberallyInclined]

17. people will disagree, but Kerry can...

kiss my arse.
he had his chance- against the worst incumbant in modern history-
and he blew it.
he refused to fight for me, and i won't be fooled again- I'll NEVER cast another vote for john kerry- or al gore- for the same reasons.

[politicasista]

19. And that attitude is why the Dems will continue to lose elections

Too busy dreaming and hoping for THE perfect candidate.

[Djinn]

27. I can live without perfect

Kerry was WOEFUL

[politicasista]

32. Who would have been better anyway?

Just curious.

[LiberallyInclined]

98. Someone with a little bit of fire in their belly.

I would have liked to have seen a Clark/Dean ticket, personally.
Kerry- and Gore in 2000- each had an aura of 'entitlement' around their candidacy...like they had earned their nominations based on their past service- not on any particular ideas or visions they had for america's future...IMHO

[Crazy Guggenheim]

28. Is he going to get John McCain to run with him this time?

:sarcasm:

[YusefHawkins]

106. Kerry wasn't the perfect candidate and I voted for him.

Not perfect but I thought he could win. For that reason alone I wanted him to beat Dean from day one in the primaries and to hold on against Edwards. Kerry has shown otherwise. He was outmaneuvered and didn't continue the fight. That is why Dems lose. They are always willing to be civil and concede. Repukes will jump up and down and act a fool like they did in Florida, even flying protesters in from other states... Like they're doing now in Washington State trying to get Gregoire 100+ days after the election.

Repukes don't "just get over it" so why should Dems?? Fight!Fight!Fight! To the bitter end. Especially when you are on the upside of a just cause. Who cares if you are going to lose in the Supreme Court. Bring it there and let them show their true colors so that they may never deny who they are. Until you force their ugliness to the forefront the repukes will continue to deny it, bury it and discredit it.

[babylonsister]

21. Well who, in your opinion, might be better? I'm all ears. But

til you top Kerry, I'll sit back and think about it.
Personally, I think the vote was stolen. Check out that venue here on DU. I am not alone.
Please check this thread out-very enlightening:

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=203&topic_id=363754&mesg_id=363754

[LiberallyInclined]

119. Kerry didn't seem to think it was stolen-

so what does it matter what you or anyone else thinks about it?

as far as topping Kerry(i could make a Bulldog Gannon joke here- but i won't), let's see-

Clark, Feingold, Boxer, Durbin...

[YusefHawkins]

120. Kerry doesn't publicly but his wife thinks the election was stolen.

http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/connelly/214744_joel07.html?source=rss


Teresa Heinz Kerry is openly skeptical about results from November's election, the SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER reports, particularly in sections of the country where optical scanners were used to record votes.

"Two brothers own 80 percent of the machines used in the United States," Heinz Kerry said. She identified both as "hard-right" Republicans. She argued that it is "very easy to hack into the mother machines."

Heinz Kerry did not offer any specific evidence that votes on the machines were altered.

"We in the United States are not a banana republic," added Heinz Kerry during a fundraiser in Seattle.

"I fear for '06," she said

http://www.drudgereport.com/flash3thk.htm

[LiberallyInclined]

129. and it matters what theresa thinks...

because...?

[YusefHawkins]

130. If Teresa thinks it you think John Kerry doesn't.

He just won't speculate or pursue it publicly but you can't say he thinks his wife is a loon or a conspiracy theorist. If she believes it you better believe he does too.

[LiberallyInclined]

134. if he believed it, why didn't he say something...? put up a fight?

do anything to make the general public aware...?

no fire in the belly...just another aristocrat looking for more power and control...fuck him- i won't waste another vote on the guy.

[kerrygoddess]

141. Maybe he's still investigating things...

and if he is he sure as hell is not going to make that public. Get a clue!

[LiberallyInclined]

143. yeah...maybe THAT'S what He's doing...

:eyes:

as far as my getting a clue is concerned- where might i find one like yours?

[YusefHawkins]

152. You can't really investigate without pissing someone off.

Secretly investigating? The Repukes raise a stink and get results. They did it in FL to stop the recount and they are doing it now in Washington to get rid of Gregoire. They got rid of Davis and got the Gropenator in California. Not by walking softly and carrying a quiet investigation, either.

[bilgewaterbill]

144. He has the stench of loser on him now. nt

[YusefHawkins]

151. For Senator I would vote for him for president I agree kuck ferry (nt)

[Crazy Guggenheim]

25. Maybe he wants to run in 08 so this time he can get John McCain

as his running mate ..............

[LittleClarkie]

64. When last seen together, Kerry was swearing like a sailor at McCain

that was before McCain went and belly bucked with Bush at one of his canned rallies, of course. But I'm not even sure the two are talking any more.

It was a wonderful dream of non-partisan healing that McCain shat upon. I don't fault Kerry for dreaming the dream.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

66. Oh. It's McCain's fault ......

[LittleClarkie]

74. For??

Could you drop the routine for a moment and explain what you're trying to get across?

What are you blaming Kerry for? For wanting a bi-partisan ticket? For thinking they were better friends than they actually turned out to be?

Or do you prefer driveby snarkiness as opposed to making yourself clear?

[Blue Belle]

102. I wouldn't vote for McCain on the ticket...

Talk about a poster boy for the phrase "Sell Out". When Bush called him up in this election, McCain just bent right over. I doubt if Kerry would even entertain the thought. It would have been the best thing for McCain's career had he run with Kerry... now he has to sleep in the bed he's made.

[LittleClarkie]

48. He didn't blow it. Or rather, he didn't blow it ALONE

We blew it.

And for some inexplicable reason, half the country thinks this is the greatest president ever, not the worst. That's how far apart the two factions are.

Anyone who thinks they can put all the blame on Kerry for the last election while leaving themselves clean and pure can kiss MY arse. If WE can't figure out why WE weren't organized enough to get the job done then WE are just courting disaster for the next time.

[YusefHawkins]

103. Gore get's my vote but kuck Ferry as President

Gore was overwhelmed, he was in a no win situation. Kerry should have kept fighting. The repukes are still trying to get Gregoire out in Washington 100+ days later. If repukes can force anything bad to happen in Washington I bet we have to go through another recall election like California. Kerry dropped the ball and got outmaneuvered.

[LiberallyInclined]

118. Gore chose Lieberman as a running mate-

That's when he lost the election.

[politicasista]

124. So Kerry wasn't overwhelmed?

Looks like you watched too much CNN or FAUX news. Gore got the popular vote, which Kerry didn't. Just like Gore, the media slammed Kerry all throughout the election. For the record, I wish he would have held out for a day or two, but you fail to understand that the corporate media would have had a field day on Kerry just like the did Gore.

Telling Kerry and to F--k off only helps him and his supporters. You think your helping your candidate by trashing another, think again.

More power to Kerry.

[YusefHawkins]

131. If Kerry wins in the primary he gets my vote until then...

I will not support him for presidency. He can be senator for life but not president. I am of the state of mind that I will support anyone but a Repuke.

I don't watch CNN, Faux or BSNBC. Let the media have a field day. If the media can intimidate you into backing down you shouldn't be president. If you're afraid of a good fight you shouldn't be president. Someone has to lead the fight or keep backing down and losing. Kerry won the popular vote the count was just manipulated. There is no way 60 million people voted for Bush. How come Repukes can still harrass Gregoire 4 months later? She's the Governor of Washington so why don't they "just get over it"? How did they get a recall election and the Gropenator in California? Repukes fight to the bitter end.

[politicasista]

133. He would have looked very foolish fighting without evidence

Duh! How do you know he doesn't think the election was stolen? I am sure he is aware what happened 11/2. BTW, did you know there is a lawsuit pending in Ohio in he and Edwards' name. I am waiting for someone to think who could be a better candidate than Kerry? Who "would have won" in your opinion?

[YusefHawkins]

150. Considering the black box issue...

No Democrat could have won. Any Democrat could have fought back. You don't find the evidence without digging and pissing people off. John Conyers found a boat load of evidence of irregularities that has been submitted and is a part of the public record in the Ohio Case against the law team that brought the first suit. You can't win the next election if you don't lay down the ground work for it. You haven't built the foundation to stand on. So who is going to start building the foundation if no one is willing to risk sacrificing himself?

Any candidate willing to fight to the bitter end would have been better. Like Bill Maher said tonight on "Real Time w/Bill Maher", "it's bad when the person with the biggest balls in your party is named Teresa".

[autorank]

18. I agree!!!

:yourock: and you ought to work for the DNC!

[iconoclastNYC]

22. One thing's certain.

The '08 primary is going to be fun. I hope those who run find great ways to bash the corrupt republican party and aid the backlash.

[bling bling]

24. I don't want Kerry to run.

A lot of people in our party just simply weren't "turned on" and energized by him. If you don't believe me, ask some of the black voters in the democratic party. Seriously.

From what I've observed, read, and heard, any Democrat that wants to win in 2008 needs to forget about Bush and stop addressing their message to people who voted for Bush and START ADDRESSING THE PEOPLE IN THE DEMOCRATIC PARTY AND THEIR NEEDS.

[politicasista]

30. We failed Kerry by not being organized and believing the lies of the media

At least I did my research on the candidate before I slam him or her.

[bling bling]

37. I'm not slamming him.

Kerry had plenty of face-time on t.v. to talk about terror and viet-nam. The media spun what he said, to be sure. But also, he could have used some of that time to talk more about issues faced by black people, poor people, women, etc.

I'm not slamming him. I've still got his bumper sticker on my car, for Pete's sake.

I don't want him to run in 2008. I stated why. I don't see how that's slamming.

[politicasista]

39. I know what you are saying but

I would have loved for him to talk more about all that. Be satisfied that he went on BET and talked to the NAACP, Urban League, and interviewed with Black magazines.

Yes, Kerry made some mistakes by not bringing us aboard sooner, but other Dems could have helped bring those issues out in the open like the program he was involved with with the inner city kids in Harlem, and other things. Shame on the campaign for not bringing that out. Why not go after the whole party? Who do you want to run in 2008? Hope you are aware that they will have a massive mess to clean up. I don't care what anyone says. I am AA and I will not abandon Kerry. I like Clinton, but we need to stop waiting for THE perfect candiate to come along. At least the repukes believe in second chances, too bad we can't say that about the Dems. It's not like Kerry lost in a landslide.

[Vektor]

49. Hiya sis!

How's it going?

[politicasista]

52. Hi Vektor

Everything's fine. Just in the middle of finals. :hi:

[Vektor]

58. Oh, yeesh!

What are you studying? (And best of luck on those finals by the way..)

[politicasista]

60. Thanks

Elementary education. I am in graduate school.

[bling bling]

55. My apologies

for using an example that assumed you weren't AA and for saying you should ask black people how they felt. Please understand that I have personally spoken with and read articles about the opinions of black people who supported Kerry, yet weren't particularly thrilled about him - which is why I used that example. I could have said women or people in poverty too -- as there were a lot of people who voted for Kerry not so much because they were enamored but because he wasn't Bush.

I take it very seriously when I hear Democrats say they don't feel that the party is addressing their needs. I believe them when they say it. I personally agree with people who say that the Democrats aren't doing enough to address people who care about improving education, health care, and the economy -- just to name a few examples.

I want someone to run in 2008 that is serious about the issues that are important to us. I want someone to run in 2008 that WE ALL feel energized and thrilled about.

I don't think Kerry is that person.

[politicasista]

71. You didn't answer my question

Who is that person? What could you have done to help Kerry inspire us? I think we are making a mistake in giving up on Kerry. Too many ignorant people played right into Bush's hands with that "I don't like Kerry. I wish someone else was running" stuff. At least I did my research too bad some peeps didn't.

[bling bling]

76. I've been saying since November 3rd

who I think that person is. That person is Obama or someone like him. You can do a search by author in the archives and look up my posts.

Obama is that person.

But I've found that as soon as his name is mentioned I get responses that range from "he's just a junior Senator -- no chance, maybe in 2018" to "we're not ready for a black president or woman president in this country -- think about the red states."

[politicasista]

121. I like Obama too but let's let him get his feet wet

I would love for him to run for president someday, but let him spend time in the Senate first.

[kerrygoddess]

140. I think you are still off base here...

I'm a 48 year old single mother who's got a home business, and I'm struggling financially and always have been (even been on welfare a couple of times). I started supporting Kerry over 2 years ago.

Why? Because I got that he cared about the "little people" and always has. If you researched his voting record and his career you would see that. Kerry understands people. He's compassionate, thoughtful, insightful, he thinks carefully about things. he's done a lot to help women, women in business, the poor, the disabled, fought for healthcare, veteran's benefits, civil rights, education, women's rights.

he tried to address people's needs but the media sold out to Bush and the Repubs a long time ago and we were screwed. Read the May issue of Vanity Fair, Robert F. Kennedy Jr article (The Disinformation Society) and maybe you won't be so quick to judge Kerry or come to conclusions about who supported him or why. The media perpetuated this bull shit and obviously you bought it. PoliticalSista is right.

[LittleClarkie]

67. I still remember reading the article that said Kerry appeared

in an AA church and was roundly criticized for it by separation of church and state groups because he was mixing politics and religion.

It seems one can't make a move in this party of ours without offending someone because they think you're headed in the wrong direction.

Poor Kerry. It must have been like being a pushmepullyou.

[Vektor]

45. There were a lot of times also -

where Kerry did address many of those things and got like NO coverage at all. I saw some great interviews and press conferences of his that were not touched by any of the MSM save for a blip on CSPAN, or BET which a lot of people don't watch because it's not sensational enough for them.

I am sad to say that no Dem, even a good one, is likely to fare well in elections with the Repukes and the Murdoch empire owning and controlling the media, plus Wally O'Dell and his Diebold machines publicly promising the election to Shrub. Ya can't beat that with a stick.

Grrrr. It sucks!

I think the problem was less Kerry, and more of the Repuke controlled media, and (voting machines) and the apathy of most middle Americans who don't bother to take the time and effort to actually find out what's really going on - they just eat whatever they are spoon-fed.

It's maddening, I say, maddening!

[LittleClarkie]

73. You know, I used to buy into the portrayal of Gore too

But I'm starting to realize how wrong that was. Think about our most prominent Democrats. So many of them have been smeared. I used to think that Kennedy was a clown, just like the sheeple press taught me to. That is, until I actually heard him speak. I agreed with about 99 percent of what he said.

If I ever have to give Hillary a good look, I'm sure I'll find I'm wrong about her too. Maybe if she gets the nom. If she does, I can't afford to remain ABC. I will HAVE to go positive like it or not. Because NEGATIVE CAMPAIGNS DON'T WORK!

[BlueIris]

81. Finally, somebody posts it.

I bitterly tell this to people all the time--"what happened here was a critical loss of faith."

[politicasista]

34. Former Kerry campaign spokeswoman said it best

in Essence magazine about Kerry's "lack of relationship" with the AA community that "it was the media's depiction rather than reality." Ms. D. Doolittle noted that Kerry was well received by Blacks. Instead, we kept repeating the media spins during the election. I am tired of this hindsight mess. We may have been asking for another four years of Bush anyway.

[second edition]

117. kERRY HAS BEEN DOING THIS!!

Review some of the issues and problems he has taken on recently and fought for. Health care for children, support for our troops, small business, Anwar,Bolton,Social Security, voting reforms. The Jackie Robinson award he worked a couple of years on. Come on, give the guy a break!

[LittleClarkie]

122. Thank you!

There is alot of assuming going on without examining actual facts. That said, I think folks will start to take more notice the farther away we get from the last election. Emotions are still a bit raw, I think.

[kerrygoddess]

146. Nah it's too easy...

Some would rather complain than see the truth!

[Swamp Rat]

26. If we live to see 2008...

[high density]

29. There's no "anybody but Bush" in '08.

Sorry, but that's not going to work.

[DanCa]

31. Kerry was robbed

While General Clark has always been my first choice I will not abandon the senator if he so chooses to run again. I think the problem is that Kerry needed more time to get his point across because the republican rank and file havent thought for themselves in the last four years. Than again imagine a Clark Kerry ticket in 08.

[chookie]

33. Nope

It didn't work for Al Gore since 2000 -- although many of us stand strongly behind what he has dared to articulate since then.

Hey -- it's not as though I think Kerry does not have the skill to be an effective President -- it's that he failed to comprehend what it would take to defeat Bush and how to accomplish it, which, like sex crimes, has a high degree of recidivism.

Something would have to happen to make people know that Kerry was hideously character assassinated in 2004. And I don't see that happening.

Barring some miracle or strange occurence, my guess for the most immediate end of the smirkista Dark Age would be the emergence of a moderate Republican who had the balls to stand up, and speak the minds of most Americans, that Bush does NOT have the real interests of Americans in mind, and that His Chimperial Highness does not represent real American values or the Constitution. Um, who stays out of small planes.....

[politicasista]

35. Blame the media for that

Sure Kerry and the campaingn made mistakes, but we need to stop this hindsight junk of who coulda, woulda, and shoulda, won. The repukes stand behind their people even though they are wrong and evil.

[chookie]

42. Point?

You're preaching to the choir. I was never disloyal to John Kerry. I worked my ass off for him despite our different positions on critical issues.

I disagree that "repukes" -- invariably -- stand behind their people even when they are wrong or evil. Only authoritarians do, and Republicans are far from being uniformly authoritarian -- it's just that the authoritarian element is most prominent now. The Republican party is in crisis today, as the result of the strong split between traditional Republican/conservative values and the wacko extremists who hijacked the party. The pol who has the good sense to work this deep divide will achieve power, and there are people who could pull it off if they had the guts, but it seems only the wackos these days have the determination to stare down the gun pointed at their head.

I agree that MSM have their heads up their asses, and do not effectively communicate important truths. But some among them do try, but institutional conditions cause their voices to die in the wind. Not fully to blame. Fact is, "blame" for Bush is the result of extreme political skills by close members of the extreme right. No decent person has come up with a way to effectively oppose them in our day.

No ordinary level of high achievement will serve in this crazy time.

If and when Kerry scores against these monsters in the Senate, I will back him, again. But my political faith in him has long flown

[LittleClarkie]

36. I think what he's doing now, which is repeating the themes of his campaign

has a similar effect without the heavy handed "I told you so"

He can say it without saying it.

Then again, little blasts from the past might not be bad, such as news article -- simple reminders of Kerry being right, again without the outright "I told you so."

[Save The World]

38. John Kerry: A little less inspiring than Bob Dole

Please.

[politicasista]

40. Just curious of who inspires you

[Crazy Guggenheim]

41. How about if you mention some possibilities and I'll tell you

if I'm inspired. Also, you should do the convinving.

[Save The World]

44. Jimmy Carter

And he's eligible for one more term.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

46. Yeah that's true. Only if Lyndon LaRouche is the VP choice............

[Save The World]

50. Lyndon LaRouche is a bigoted lunatic

Jimmy Carter was the last really liberal President of this nation.

[Crazy Guggenheim]

51. I know I 'm just kidding. lol.

[Save The World]

54. Sorry

A bit hypersensitive on my part.

Anyway, if Robert Byrd can run for another 6 year Senate term at age 89 then Jimmy Carter can run for a four year term at age 85.

[Mass]

95. You want to lose MA once more??

[Save The World]

138. At least Carter once won a Presidential election

Name one other Democratic candidate eligible to run in 'o8 who can say the same.

[LittleClarkie]

43. I'll thank you to not compare a great American to a piece of pond scum

John Kerry would not have sold a fellow veteran down the river the way Bob Dole did.

I don't ever remember Bob Dole getting fired up the way Kerry could. I don't remember Bob Dole being terribly inspiring during his debates, energizing the base. I saw the reaction for myself down at HQ.

I don't know who you were watching, or if you were paying much attention to the man at all, but I also doubt that Bob Dole could work a crowd one on one the way Kerry could. He would try to listen to each one as he shook their hand.

How much corruption did Bob Dole uncover? What did Bob Dole ever do for his fellow veterans that compared to the founding of the Vietnam Veterans of America.

Did Bob Dole ever help stop a war?

I find John Kerry quite inspiring, thank you very much.

[Save The World]

47. It's lovely that he inspired you

Too bad he failed so miserably with the rest of the nation. A cardboard cutout should have been able to beat Bush. Tens of millions voted against Bush.

Tens voted for Kerry.

[Vektor]

53. Tens?

That might be an unfair assessment considering his campaign site alone had 3,000,000 volunteers, and his rallies would pull in record crowds. Where are you getting these statistics from? May I ask who you voted for?

[Save The World]

57. Tens

Hyperbole. My point was that the campaign was much more anti-Bush than pro-Kerry, which is no way to win. With respect to the original post, whoever the Dem candidate winds up being better have something better than "we told you so" as a campaign theme. Optimism wins.

[Vektor]

61. Partial agreement. :-)

Yes, I too would like to see more than "I told you so" though it is a start. I think a lot of moderate Republicans are going to be pretty disenchanted with Shrub-hole by 2008 and not at all pleased that they voted for him. The whispers are already on the wind.

I guess I didn't see the campaign as anything other than pro-Kerry - I do feel he has a lot to offer, and felt that he definitely ran circles around Shrub and his bizarre secret rallies and loyalty oaths.

Ah well, perception is everything. From where we stood, we likely saw two different things. It happens. I never thought Kerry's campaign was anti-Bush enough. I had hoped he'd drag him through the mud a little MORE to be honest.

Maybe a steel cage match.

[LittleClarkie]

63. It wasn't Kerry's fault that there were people on our side

who would normally have voted Green or somesuch. In fact, I'd appreciate it if those voters would go back to voting FOR the candidates they want and not AGAINST the candidates they don't want.

Y'all Dole-d my candidate, dagnabit!

I fear the hyper-critical negativity of a group of people who really don't believe in the Democratic Party doesn't help us move forward in a positive manner. They need to go where they can effect positive action, not negative punishment when a politician doesn't do what they want him/her to do, as in the recent moveon.org ad campaign.

I'd rather have a small, but more positive and inspired group of people than a larger, but more critical, negative and angry group of people trying to move forward.

[sandnsea]

78. Well

You apparently weren't around here during the campaign when everybody was saying fuck optimism, let's beat the hell out of Bush.

The campaign was plenty optimistic enough for me. I felt alot more hopeful last year than I do now. Much more because of what I knew Kerry would do, not just because of being rid of Bush.

Every time Bush rolls out some dumbass plan, everybody remembers what Kerry would have done. And is sad at the loss. The campaign wasn't ABB. If you believed that, you believed right wing spin.

[LittleClarkie]

59. Oh yeah man, I only went to the rally to see Jon BonJovi

That's why I stood in the rain for two hours until I couldn't feel my feet. And about 10 thousand people along with me as well. We all wanted really, really badly to see Jon BonJovi since two acoustic songs in the drizzling rain.

Riiiiight.

[Save The World]

62. I completely sympathize

Did the same thing during the "Slippery When Wet" tour ... ah, youth ...

[LittleClarkie]

70. Oh dear

forgot something :sarcasm:

I don't feel that way about Jon Bon Jovi. I was being sarcastic.

Now if it had been the Monkees, mind you...

[Vektor]

75. I don't know about you,

but I went to see that hot Dem piece of sex, John Kerry.

And now, a lover's haiku.

waited for hours
to catch a glimpse of beefcake
me love him long time

[LittleClarkie]

56. What ARE you talking about

You're description better fits the campaigns of Mondale or Dukakis or, bless his heart, McGovern.

I've been asking, btw, since November 3rd for someone to give me empirical evidence of ABB vs Kerry supporter on our side in the last election. Haven't gotten it yet. A poll would be nice. Something other than andedotal stories or the crap I heard Rush Limbaugh spout during the campaign. I can imagine an ABBer has many friends who are also ABB, but that doesn't mean you represent Kerry voters as a whole.

Several of us who started out ABB ended up admiring the man. Who has taken a poll of them?

[bling bling]

68. Here's something about black voters and ABB.

I just happened to have it bookmarked. I wouldn't say it's empirical, necessarily, but I had it handy.

http://www.laweekly.com/ink/04/35/15-kelley.php

[LittleClarkie]

84. Thank you for the resource

I don't know if it's what the author had in mind, but I know we had AA specific stuff on hand, at least buttons and stickers anyway. And, I know that while Jesse Jackson was grousing that Kerry didn't come to his rally in Ohio, Kerry was actually at a rally with Stephanie Tubbs.

Sometimes I wonder if some folks aren't trying to make a name for themselves at the expense of others. Jackson certainly hits me that way at times.

All I have is the two black persons I work with who said they thought Kerry was a good man. But I think if we lost some of the black vote, it was the church's reaction to the push button issues as much as anything, gay marriage and the like. I've heard that here and there on DU as well. It seems some persons of color will have to choose between what they want economically and the more conservative values of their faith that are against gay marriage and such.

[Mass]

94. I am sure you have basis for this

or may be I should say 10 people voted for Clinton in 1992.

[BlueIris]

72. Ouch. That hurts.

Dude...that's just cruel.

[Vektor]

77. Oh! I thought you meant THESE EIGHT WORDS:

"Gather 'round ladies. Yes, it's really that big."

[JI7]

79. i wish this person's head was not in the way

[Vektor]

80. AUUURRGGHHH THE PAIN.

I wish my head WERE in the way.

Lookit that facial expression, and the open palmed hand.

Who's yer daddy, baby? *SMACK*

[BlueIris]

82. Ah, Vektor. I wish I still smoked. n/t

[Vektor]

83. Smoke this:

:evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin: :evilgrin:

[BlueIris]

135. You know,

If I could I would.

[LittleClarkie]

85. Ahem, middle right

Weapon of Mass Distraction of the starboard bow!

[Vektor]

86. Oh. My. God

I want to eat him.

I am utterly astounded that anything can be so beautiful.

And appetizing.

Ok, second row down, black and white picture, far right.

:nuke: *UTERINE IMPLOSION *:nuke:

[JI7]

87. the one with him in the black shirt ?

i would love to see a larger image of that one. i don't think i have ever seen that one before.

[Vektor]

88. Yes.

Um. Pants.
:wow:

[LittleClarkie]

89. I rather like this one as well

Less libidinous than really cute.

[Vektor]

90. That IS cute - I like this:

Hey John, will you make me one of those?

[LittleClarkie]

91. And this one from the Texas gathering

He looks so radiant there. I think the size of the crowd surprised him.

[Vektor]

92. BEAUTIFUL. OMG - tell me THIS doesn't make you feel super dirty:

[Jo March]

116. I love that picture and I'm bookmarking this thread

I miss seeing Kerry so much. :(

[BlueIris]

136. Oh yeah. Bookmark mandatory.

We all miss seeing Kerry.

[kerrygoddess]

148. Love that!

[Blue Belle]

107. That's a great photo...

It really captures how sexy he is.
:blush:

[Mass]

93. Sad thread

We can see the Democrats at their worst here.

Cant we just focus on the opposition or on those Democrats that broke the filibuster on Johnson or voted for the Bankruptcy Bill (including the great Byrd). I guess Byrd is really losing it now. It may be time to run somebody else in WV.

[LynneSin]

96. Sorry, we've loss 2 elections because we've had candidates...

..with absolutely no charisma whatsoever to reach out to everyday folks. I love Al Gore & John Kerry but they came off to elitist (yeah, and the elections were fixed too). Bill Clinton won because he has this massive appeal that reached out to all sorts of folks despite all his controversy.

There are great candidates who have this same sort of Charisma with Ed Rendell coming to the top of my short list. Kerry had a chance and didn't win. And what pissed me off the most is he gave up without promising to "Count all the Votes"

Time to Moveon!

[second edition]

113. THIS PHILADELPHIAN WOULD NOT VOTE FOR RENDELL

even though I supported him in his race for Governor of Pennsylvania. He may be in the Clinton mold, but comes across as a bit shady. I liked President Clinton, however some of the moral issues we face now can be attributed to his "problems".I don't by into the view that our president should be just like us and come across as a drinking buddy or pal. I want our president to run our country with intelligence and integrity and be well respected throughout the world- the last thing i want is to have a beer with him.

[Mass]

123. Rendell has no charisma...

[ecstatic]

97. All Kerry can do is endorse someone else

A qualified fighter. Kerry had his chance and blew it. Sorry. No offense to his supporters.

[second edition]

114. Many of our great leaders have lost and come back to win

another day. Don't count Kerry out- another time another race. Who knows?

[realFedUp]

99. I can't do Kerry again

I rarely post on these what if threads, but
I can't do Kerry or Theresa's speeches again,
without being heavily medicated. I can do
Gore again before I do Kerry. And I'm not
talking BJs.

[Zynx]

100. People don't like being told "I said so." They really don't.

Kerry did not run a good campaign and did not fight. The only reason we nominated him was "Electable, can beat Bush."

That didn't work. So why do it again?

[lateo]

101. Screw Kerry.

He doesn't deserve another chance.

[politicasista]

125. Telling Kerry to F--k off only helps him

More power to him.

[Cuban_Liberal]

104. FOUR words:

"I told you so".

[Name removed]

105. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[AlGore-08.com]

109. But Gore warned us before Kerry did - - and warned about more

For example, he warned us that the invasion of Iraq would be a disaster, and that Congress should vote down the resolution. Ditto the Patriot Act.

He spent the entire 2000 campaign warning us how Smirk's tax cuts would destroy the prosperity, how social security would be in danger under Smirk, how the courts would be in danger, how our civil rights would be under assault, how the environment would suffer, and how the powerful, not the people, were all that Smirk cared about.

And, no offense to Senator Kerry, but Gore won the popular vote by half a million votes and Kerry lost it by over 3 million votes, even though Gore started his campaign out 20 points behind and was outspent 2 to 1 and did not have the extra hundreds of millions of dollars the pro-Dem 527s spent on the 2004 cycle.

So if your strategy would work, it would work better for Gore.

[barb162]

110. I like this line

can I add a few more words at the end: "caused by those Republicans"

But if you do, you have to do a Zell from Hell Miller sneer when you get to the last two words.

[SammyWinstonJack]

111. Gore warned us

Fat lot of good that did in '04, and yes I know Kerry actually won the election, which is my point. Doesn't matter how many warnings our candidate gives out as long as the repugs are counting the votes.

[second edition]

112. KERRY HAS BE RIGHT ON JUST ABOUT EVERYTHING!

I will absolutely vote for him again if he runs.Your comment is a good beginning. His appeal goes beyond that of a good salesman. HE IS A STATESMAN. HE IS A TRUE PATRIOT. Think in terms of some of our best and beloved presidents-Washington, Jefferson,Lincoln and Kennedy. He is intelligent, articulate and presidential in stature. And I think he would be warmly received by the general public if he decides to run again. They had only a limited time to actually get to know him. HIS APPEAL GROWS WITH MORE EXPOSURE. Honesty and integrity and genuine concern are virtues we should demand from our presidents. These is more at stake then just putting forth a name or personality or run someone because they come from a red state. The direction of our country should concern us all. What other possible candidates come close to matching the vast knowledge and experience that John Kerry has. For me its John Kerry in 2008, if we are lucky enough to have him run again.

[ginnyinWI]

127. and he's been voting the right way on every issue this year

unlike some of the Dems!

Not only is he honest, he'd have been a great president because of his combination of imagination and practical solutions. I've just finished reading his "A Call to Service" for the first time. He has enough great ideas for improving this country to make him another FDR if he should get the chance. It blew me away--his thorough knowledge of the issues, and his far-reaching vision!

[BlueIris]

137. Knock on wood.

Senator, if you've received my latest correspondence, you know what I'm referring to. I know what the strategy is supposed to be and supposed to achieve, I know you're under pressure, but don't do it. I will be so disappointed. Y'all? Not trying to "start something." Please continue to support Kerry if you already know he's the right president for you. I know I will, even if it might not be as much fun in the future.

[bvar22]

126. Kerry can lose with just 6 words in 2008.

We can still win in Iraq.

[rinsd]

128. Nothing rallies the troops like an "I told ya so"... (nt)

[lawladyprof]

132. I don't need a perfect president, mere competence will do--eom

N/T

[UdoKier]

145. America was already in a shithole last fall. Bush was already a disaster.

Not to mention relatively unpopular. If Kerry had really wanted to win, he could have.

But I think he threw it. Bonesmen...

[mondo joe]

147. Or he can just say nce more that he'd still vote approve the war.

<sigh>

[Wizard777]

149. I would consider Kerry IF

He can blow them shrimpboat bastards out of the water before the primaries. We would be better off bringing back Gore with his Lock Box. Now that you see I was right lets fix this mess. Now that you have seen how the President and Senate can pick the lock on that box just as easily as your older brother. How about a vault with armed guards that have orders to shoot to kill anyone that tries to spend your retirement money on anything other than your retirement? George Bush has Admited with his SS plan that the Republicans can't be trusted with your retirement money that they haven't spent and tried to give it away to the profiteers of private industry. These are some of the same people that got rich bankrupting the S&L industry. These are some of the same people that wanted to bill you for using a teller to deposit or withdrawl the money you are lending them. The Democrats have preserved your right to retirement by keeping SS. Now we have to protect that money from the Bush's, Cheney's, The Republicans of Congress, and anyone else trying to spend your retirement money before you do.