Anyone think Howard Dean's too "out there" to run the DNC?

[senseandsensibility]

Read this at the Daily Howler, and tell me that things could get any worse: http://dailyhowler.com/

The sheer ineptitude boggles the mind, doesn't it?:-(
Edited to add: Please see my post #19 below in which I explain my reasons for linking to this.

[Sannum]

1. .

:eyes:

[mike_c]

2. only in the sense that he's not liberal enough for my taste...

...but he's a damn sight better than anything the DLC has to offer!

[CAcyclist]

7. I'll second that - we need his bravery most right now n/t

[Rockerdem]

20. Dean is moderately liberal - right in step with the majority of the US

I was to hurl everytime that I hear some MSM whore regurgitate the unfounded "truism" that the country is moderately conservative. BS. If so, why is Bush feel the need to add social programs like the pill benefit, no matter how lame?

If Bush felt that the country was conservative or evangelical, he would have answered the "gay" question in the debate much differently than he did. When asked whether they were born that way, he would have said "no" and mentioned the Bible. Instead, he felt compelled to give an answer more in step with the current body of science; namely, "I don't know." He chose reason over religion, not that he believed it, but because he felt that was what the country wanted to hear. And where it was at -- moderately liberal.

I know where the country was in the 50s (segregation, pollution, women's rights, Medicare) and I know where it is now. All that progress didn't happen because people are more conservative than liberal. They're not perfect by a long shot, but they are better than what commentators make them out to be

[mike_c]

25. agreed-- the problem is that *I'm* not in step with the majority...

...of the U.S. :)

BTW-- Welcome to DU.

[Melodybe]

3. No, Dean is fine, we need someone like him

he is the one building the party, no other democrats are gathering support for the democratic cause like Dean is.

[asjr]

11. Howard Dean rallied everyone to the cause a long

time ago. If we had more Dems vote this time we owe it to him. We have had no one like him before. I was with him from the beginning.

[Jack_DeLeon]

4. No Howard Dean is not "too out there."

He seemed to be the only candidate that was really mentioned anything about "states rights," he would have done better in the South because of that than Kerry did.

[graywarrior]

5. Seems like the present DNC is "too out there"

They don't even know what the people want, never mind relate to us.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

6. It's time

If I have to live through another goddamn cycle of Democrats beating their own brows and trying to figure out how to be "more moderate," I'm telling you now, someone somewhere is gonna get hurt. More likely than not, it'll be feline, and I can't even vouch for whose cat's gonna get it.

No, I'm just kidding about the cat.

Dean's fearless, and we desperately need fearless.

[MADem]

13. Excellent, succinct assessment

He IS fearless. He speaks in short, intelligent sentences, he GRABS your attention, and even people who don't agree with him get a strong sense of a guy who knows what he is doing and knows how to get it done. You instinctively respect him.

Also...He's TV GOLD--just the airtime he'd get would help us at ALL levels, not just the national level.

[madfloridian]

16. You got it! That is our man.

:hi:

[KnowerOfLogic]

8. Absolutely not. Dean is the best thing that's happened to the

democratic party in a long freaking time. The present crop of namby-pamby so-called dem leaders are worse than worthless.

[tridim]

9. Howard Dean being "out there" is a media driven myth

In fact he's the most down to earth politician I've ever met. He's exactly what this country needs now.

[Pig_Latin_Lover]

10. Definitely not

If Dean can do for the DNC what he did with "Democracy for America", we'd have the Karl Roves of the world hiding in fear.

[madfloridian]

12. I don't see anything about Dean at that link, not recently.

Somerby despises Dean, has been terribly rude to those who wrote him about an error he made once....even calling some of us crazy. :silly:

Whatever it is you are referring to, I will say Dean is not too far out at all....That is silly.

[senseandsensibility]

19. No, Dean's not mentioned there

I was just making the point (it's kind of buried in the piece) that the current crew is so inept that there's nothing to be afraid of from Dean. The examples in the article are infuriating to me, because they confirm what I was screaming about all Summer: no one was preparing the Dem reps for the talking head shows, not even during the height of the swiftboat deal. Unfrigginblelievable. So, with that track record, is it possible we might need a change instead of more of the same? Just maybe? The piece also confirms what I was trying to post during August, namely, that it IS the DNC's responsibility to "prep" Dems who appear on these corporate shows. AND THEY WEREN'T DOING IT, not even during August, as Kerry's lead started to slip away.

[AgadorSparticus]

14. wow, the democratic moderate powers that be must be really afraid

of Dean. more and more anti dean sentiment keep popping up. hmmmmmmm, interesting.....

[madfloridian]

15. Yes, that is correct.

Very interesting.

[Sick_of_Rethuggery]

17. As a matter of fact,

Dean is the only currently prominent Democrat who seems to have his feet firmly on the ground -- all the so-called leaders of the party are living in some fantasy land where there is no evil (aka GOP). Dean (and among the dearly-departed from the political scene, Al Gore) are the only ones who get the utter depravity of both the GOP leadership and the media...

[LiberteToujours]

18. Name one "out there" thing that he has actually done

Look at his record as governor of Vermont. He is hardly "out there". He is a stable leader with a good grasp of economics and social policy, every bit as good as the next guy. But where he really shines through is in his ability to speak from his heart and really get people to feel through him.

Why is the DNC so afraid of this? Why are they so determined to keep all passion out of their party? It's almost like they want to keep losing. If Dean gets character assassinated yet again, I think it's time that the the progressive wing of the USA looks seriously at third party alternatives. You're going to keep losing with the DNC around anyway, so why not start thinking long term and doing what is necessary to eventually turn things back around? It might been fracturing the vote in 2008 and losing, but you're going to lose ANYWAY with the current DNC leadership.

[fnottr]

26. exactly

The only thing that makes him 'out there' is that he's just about the only Democrat who's willing to call a spade a spade when talking about the current administration.

Look at his positions on the issues, there aren't too much different from Kerry's, even about Iraq. He just didn't dance around the issue 3 weeks before the election like Kerry did.

[Eurobabe]

33. this is about the only thing I can think of....

http://politicalhumor.about.com/library/multimedia/dean_nuts.mpga

I really don't understand why everyone freaked over the scream. I have come to respect Dean tremendously.

[OldLeftieLawyer]

41. That "shouting" thing was .....

...........a creation of the media. He never "lost it" that night, he was shouting to be heard amidst a roaring throng of supporters, and the media turned him into a red-faced, raging lunatic.

I was aghast at that from the beginning, and, as I watched it obliterate his true persona, I remembered how the media latched onto Clinton's sex life and never, ever gave his brilliance in office its proper due.

Left-wing media, my ass.

Dean would be a ballbuster as head of the DNC, and that's exactly what we need now.

[Daisey Mae]

21. He will be great

[AllyCat]

22. I was not a Dean supporter in the primaries, but...

...I think he is perfect for this job. We need someone to shake up this party and get it moving again. Dean has fundraising prowess and can get people working for the cause.

[theHandpuppet]

23. If Dr. Dean is too "out there" for the Democratic Party...

... then I'm wasting my time trying to work within this party and will be looking for alternatives come 2008.

[Name removed]

24. Deleted message

Message removed by moderator. Click here to review the message board rules.

[ever_green]

30. exactly.

They are scared sh*tless of him.

[proudbluestater]

27. He is just what the party needs!

He and he alone woke this party up during the primaries. Nobody paid attention until somebody happened to notice that he was kicking serious butt and raising tons on the Internet.

We need his new energy. The DLC has brought us nothing but failure and Caspar Milquetoast spokespeople like Terry McAuliffe. We need somebody who is not afraid to speak his mind, take prisoners and ask questions later, if ever.

[Hamlette]

28. I agree, he's too moderate

and the link is exactly what is pissing me off about this party. I have a full time job, a full time hobby and I'm a wife and mother and I'm 100% more informed that the idiots who speak for dems on pundit shows.

I have tried to give them credit once in awhile for freezing since I've done that myself. But OVER AND OVER AND OVER AGAIN! I'm sick to death of it. Why isn't someone high up in the party reading DU to find out what is going on in the world of politics? Are they just not interested?

My friends tell me all the time I should be a pundit because I'm so well informed and I'm not half as informed as most people here.

We're interested.

[Guaranteed]

29. "Too out there?" WTF are they talking about?

What's "too out there" about him? The man is right about EVERYTHING.

[Andromeda]

31. You're right about things getting worse.

Pathetic, isn't it? Our Democratic leaders need spinal transplants. It's too late to do anything about it now but we sure can do something about the future.

Howard Dean is going to play a dominant role in the Democratic party's future and we, the people, need to make our voices heard above the Joe Liebermans and others like him who, because of this private little club they have, want to shut Dean out.

When Dean was running for the Presidential nomination he was out in front until the primaries. He got the media spotlight because he is such a strong presence.

Howard Dean got more attention than anybody else for a reason: He connected to the people. Why? Because he told the truth and he didn't play games.

The media loved Dean as long as he was on top and when they found some chinks in his armor they tried to destroy him.

This kind of treatment did not stop Dean from his goals of changing the Democratic party.

Dean's still going strong and he's not going anywhere, thank God.

[HR_Pufnstuf]

32. out there where??

Out in the lead when it comes to new ideas, HELL YES!

[eridani]

34. Who the hell else is actually doing party building?

Dean is actively encouraging the next generation of leaders. Vilsak is probably fine as a governor, but he damn well isn't doing anything like that.

[gulfcoastliberal]

35. Wow. That Howler exposes just how pathetic the DNC has been...

unfucking believable that in August, AUGUST, the campaign and DNC had no talking points regarding the SBVs - none?!:

THOMAS (11/15/04): In early August, when the Swift Boat story started to pick up steam on the talk shows, Susan Estrich, a California law professor, well-known liberal talking head and onetime campaign manager for Michael Dukakis, had called the Kerry campaign for marching orders. She had been booked on Fox's “Hannity & Colmes” to talk about the Swift Boat ads. What are the talking points? Estrich asked the Kerry campaign. There are none, she was told. Estrich was startled.

Unacceptable. Lame. What a waste of money, what the fuck did the DNC/KE04 exactly do with our money? Oh, take orders from McCain on what ads they were allowed to run, that's right.

If they don't make Dean the head of DNC and do whatever he wants, I am so fucking out of this country. You guys have fun trying to form a 3rd party. That's when people start getting disappeared - the CIA should be full of eager bloodthirsty Bushborg by then.

[sherilocks]

36. I was screaming the answers to my TV set

when the Democrats would have inept responses to the repug propaganda, which was often. Thanks for the link to a very insightly piece.

[lojasmo]

37. Dean would knock heads

But the usual suspects (Kerry, Novak, lieberman) are saying he's too "left"

It's Iowa repeated. The democratic party doesn't deserve Dean. He should let them wallow in their vilesack for a few years and continue to work with DFA.

[Walt Starr]

38. Dean is precisely what this party needs to move forward

which means that Dean will NOT be the chair of the DNC because that would just make too damn much sense.

[Frumious B]

39. I'm just to the left of center on most things...

and I can't say I've ever heard Dean say anything on a big issue with which I particularly disagree. He definitely strikes me as a common sense, down to Earth type.

[Walt Starr]

40. Your response is further proof of what I say

It would just make too damn much sense for Dean to chair the DNC, so we'll probably have Vilsack as the chair, we'll move further to the right in order to further blur distinctions between the Democrats and the Republicans and end up losing even more seats to the Republicans in 2006!

It's hard to break a cycle, especially with entrenched leadership that are unwilling to give up any of their dwindling power.

[twenty2strings]

44. steamroller the dnc...!

IN a nice way, of course. Jim Hightower and Ivins say we need to give up no ground in the fight for what we believe in. What we have accomplished so far is in no way discouraging. Sack the hacks. There should be no "Mr. Whipple" types. I say grab the fuck out of that Charmin and squeeze the livin' three ply out of it!:grr:

[Cheswick2.0]

42. there ya go

it's not about right and left, it is about right and wrong. That is the thing our democratic party is so clueless about. All people need jobs and healtcare. All people given honest information can tell a just war from an unjust war. All people know it is wrong to discriminate against any group. Our problem is that no one tells people the truth about anything. Dean tells the truth.

[BlueInRed]

43. No

And be specific. Which policy is it exactly that is too "out there"? Fiscal responsibility? Iraq and Al Qaeda? Health care? Non-discrimination against gays?

And please don't tell me it's the media created scream that blocks out all the crowd noise Dean was trying to scream over.

[chyjo]

45. As someone who did not like Howard Dean in the primaries

I can honestly say that I think DNC chair is the perfect place for him.

[tomfodw]

46. The only choice that's "too out there" is an accommodationist

We've learned - at least, I hope we've learned - that there is no way to be nice to the Republicans and survive. They are the true "wolfpack" - any concession is, to them, a sign of weakness on which they immediately pounce. Every attempt to work with them becomes a signal to them to demand another concession, and then another, and then another. We've ceded far too much ground to them already.

What we need at the head of the party is a pit-bull, a meanspirited, evil scumbag who wants to tear the GOP's heads off and piss down their necks, who won't be satisfied until George W. Bush is wearing striped pajamas and breaking rocks with a sledgehammer while chained between an axe-murderer on one side and a multiple child-rapist on the other.

I'm not saying that will or even can happen, but that's the attitude we need at the DNC. Anything less is a giveaway.