I would like a brief overview of Vatican II and Opus Dei

[pie]

Just the talking points, if you will.

[murdoch]

1. V2 and OD

Vatican II was when the Catholic church "modernized" and "liberalized" which means it moved from the 8th century into the 18th century (in the 1960s).

Opus Dei is a group of wealthy, high up conservative Catholics. One thing I heard about them is they flagellate (whip) themselves, or at least some of them do. I asked my mother and she doesn't know if they do it but she knows some Catholic orders and so forth still do this. Actually in some parts of the world they do the passion play and actually crucify somebody (except they don't leave them up for three days, they live).

[pie]

2. I have seen Passion Plays where they string Christ up

But only for a minute.

[Selteri]

5. Opus Dei Practices include

Reading each other's mail

Requiring that one cannot purchase a book without an 'elder' member of the church approving it.

Self Fladulation for 'sins'

Wearing a 'Circe' up to 2 hours a day for sins, this is a barbed belt that is worn on the thigh that is supposed to remind people of their sins of lust and such. They are supposedly derived from the crown of thorns Jesus wore.

Women are inferior and must use an alternate entrance to the church. THey may only be at the church to clean or worship.

They are intlerant of other religions, by edict.

They contribute to conservative movements and the Republican Party

They require a tithe of 10% and use auditors to discover if the tithing is done truthfully.

http://www.mond.at/opus.dei/opus.dei.uo.faq.html - is a good FAQ on them.
http://www.mond.at/opus.dei/ is the main page
http://www.beliefnet.com/story/69/story_6980_1.html - another link

And finally, Their official FAQ http://www.opusdei.org/art.php?w=32&p=287
and Website
http://WWW/opusdei.org

[pie]

6. scary

[pie]

7. How is Pope Benedict related to Opus Dei?

[Selteri]

9. So far as I know, Benny 16 has not spo\ken publically

about Opus Dei, but he has stated that we need to undo some of the mistakes of V2.

[LeinesRed]

3. Vatican II = GOOD Opus Dei = BAD n/t

[pie]

4. I hope someone lists the Vatican II highlights

[Selteri]

8. Happy to do so. Vatican 2 Highlights

First - Mass isn't just in Latin anymore.

Officially V2 also allowed for tolerance of other 'christian' religions

It emphasized more the peaceful teachings of Jesus and lowered the requirements for self inflicted punishment.

They decreed the wish to bring the church back together into one mother religion rather than the fragmentation that the church has been doing.

Braodened access to communion for people who are sinners provided that they 'truly wish to become more christlike'.

Expressed formally that there were merits to 'some' non-christian religions.

[pie]

10. Excellent summary.

I recall having to fast 12 hours before communion
and having to sit thru the Latin Mass.
I did not realize The Church recognized the merit
of any non-Christian religion.
Fascinating.

[Selteri]

11. Some of the rules, like fasting, have become 'softened'

Of course, the irony is that I'm a flat out Pagan by chirch definitions as a Deist/Spritualist.

I was raised Lutheran-Catholic though.