BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:44 PM
Original message |
Poll question: Is the word PRESIDENTIAL inherently sexist? |
Skinner
ADMIN
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:44 PM
Response to Original message |
1. Would you care to explain? |
|
I have never heard this before.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:58 PM
Response to Reply #1 |
6. Being that all U.S. presidents have been men, |
|
is there an expectation that one must be like a man (like those men) in order to be presidential?
|
Skinner
ADMIN
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:03 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
14. I guess I see your point. |
|
I guess it depends on what an individual sees in their mind when they think about what makes one presidential.
All U.S. presidents have also been white. So, perhaps for some people the there is an expectation that one must be white to be presidential.
I suspect that come January 2009, the definition of "presidential" will have broadened a bit.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:13 PM
Response to Reply #14 |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 07:20 PM by BuyingThyme
Maybe breast feeding will someday be presidential. Like cutting the brush.
ON EDIT AFTERTHOUGHT: Can cutting the brush be presidential for a man (or Chimp) but not so presidential for a woman?
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:09 PM
Response to Reply #6 |
17. When Kathleen Sebelius Gave The SOTU Response, I Was Amazingly Impressed With How Presidential I |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 07:09 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
thought she came off. The reason I thought that was because of her intellect, tone, vibe of leadership, and all around presentation. But none of that was due to my thinking she was being like a man somehow. I just thought she came off as extremely presidential. So based on that, I'd have to say the answer to your OP is no. :P
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:15 PM
Response to Reply #17 |
22. From where does that vibe of leadership originate? |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #22 |
25. Leaders? Not Sure How To Answer That Question. |
|
Are you implying that leadership is sexist too? Are you implying that you don't know the qualities of what makes one a leader? Have you not been aware of any strong women leaders? Are you trying to now portray a mindset that no matter how someone responds to your poll or questions, that you're going to hold onto your position that it IS inherently sexist?
I know a ton of women leaders and had a female boss who was the best boss I've ever had. There are women leaders all over the place and I find your question to be seriously flawed in intent.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:30 PM
Response to Reply #25 |
31. How can a question be flawed in intent? |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:39 PM
Response to Reply #31 |
36. When A Question Is Asked With A Tone Of Sincerity, But In Fact Is Being Asked With A Tone Of |
|
stubbornness, then the intent is flawed.
Meaning in this case, you aren't really interested in others opinions as it relates to whether or not there is inherent sexism. You're already convinced there is. You're already convinced that any of the qualities that make someone 'presidential' are also inherently sexist, so even using them as defense would be irrelevant to you since you would still hold firm to your flawed ideal.
Now granted, I'm not saying for certain that's what you're doing here. I'm just saying that based on the way you've responded, that I no longer consider your intent to be one of genuine disposition, but instead one of "I don't care what you say, people regard 'presidential' as being inherently male". Well if that's truly the way you feel, I can't stop ya. But you're wrong.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:50 PM
Response to Reply #36 |
40. Then we find your responses were flawed in intent because |
|
I truly wonder what people are talking about when they speak in presidential terms.
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:54 PM
Response to Reply #40 |
|
And you have exposed yourself now as being the originator of an impossible equation. You don't have the slightest bit of sincere intention here, and you only desire to ask a gazillion questions to any response you get until finally the poster gives up and you pat yourself on the shoulder smugly as if to falsely convince yourself that you won somehow, and that it IS in fact inherently sexist. But I have no desire to go down that petty overanalyzed circle jerk with you, because I already see exactly what your true intentions are. No matter how someone responds, no matter what kind of explanation one gives, no matter how many follow up questions of yours they need to answer to go even deeper in detail as to what each quality represents, they will get no where with you. You are convinced in your own little bubble that presidential is inherently sexist and male, and there isn't a part of your mind open to the reality that it could be otherwise, or open to the opinions of others as to why.
You've made that clear to me now, and I have no desire to pretend we could have a sincere or genuine discussion, when it's clear that your only purpose is to try and convince others of a point that truly doesn't exist. Total waste of time. Bye!
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:58 PM
Response to Reply #41 |
42. Lay off the crazy sauce. |
|
I'm asking questions to find out what people perceive as presidential.
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:04 PM
Response to Reply #42 |
43. You Ain't Foolin Anybody. |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:09 PM
Response to Reply #43 |
46. I fooled you without even trying. |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:13 PM
Response to Reply #46 |
47. Whatever Makes You Feel Self Important! |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:19 PM
Response to Reply #47 |
|
Read what you've written in this thread and attempt to explain your motivation.
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:23 PM
Response to Reply #52 |
54. My Motivation Had Been To Sincerely Answer Your Question, Until It Became Clear That You Had No |
|
interest in a real conversation. I think it's beyond evident that you're firmly standing behind a point that doesn't truly exist except for within your own mind.
You came in asking if the term was inherently sexist. Several have replied with reasons stating know and far more voted no. But none of that is good enough, since I'd wager you still believe 100% that it is.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:32 PM
Response to Reply #54 |
55. So, because you drank all that crazy sauce, |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 08:33 PM by BuyingThyme
you decided that (1) my opinion does not count and (2) that I think that my opinion is the only one that counts and (3) that's what counts the most.
Has it occurred to you that you're just projecting your thought processes on me because you hate yourself and are looking for a way to express how you feel?
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #42 |
50. Oh. And Speaking Of Crazy Sauce, You Never Answered Who The Fuck 'We' Was. |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:35 PM
Response to Reply #50 |
56. We are you and me and anybody else who wants to participate. |
REP
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:46 PM
Response to Original message |
2. Why can't I vote "WTF"? |
Seabiscuit
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:46 PM
Response to Reply #2 |
39. Same question I'm asking. |
Radical Activist
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:46 PM
Response to Original message |
3. Unless you think the qualities that make a good President |
|
are inherently male, then no.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #3 |
16. Does one have to be a good president to be presidential? |
Orangepeel
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:48 PM
Response to Original message |
4. No. But if you said Clinton is running to be "presidentess" it would be |
|
It is sexist to feminize words that don't need to be feminized, like calling a female pilot a "pilotess" (or, a "female pilot" for that matter). There is no reason that I know of that "presidential" is sexist.
|
Captain Hilts
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:18 PM
Response to Reply #4 |
51. Aviatrix. Murderess. etc. nt |
uppityperson
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:54 PM
Response to Original message |
5. Off to dictionary.com... I'm back and laughing at my next thought (about "dictionary") |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 07:09 PM by uppityperson
I don't see what you are getting at, but started to wonder: Is "dictionary" inherently sexist? Why isn't there a clitionary?
|
tammywammy
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:59 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
BattyDem
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:04 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:05 PM
Response to Reply #5 |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 08:14 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
:rofl:
I'm thinkin cause a dictionary doesn't mind being touched by anyone, whereas the clitionary would demand dinner first?
|
XemaSab
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:58 PM
Response to Original message |
7. Can't spell presidential without "Penis." |
|
That and "rat deli." :hide:
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:16 PM
Response to Reply #7 |
48. Can't Spell It Without Dental Either. Teeth: We All Have Them, Except For Freepers. |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 08:17 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
Therefore, the word isn't sexist, it just means that freepers shouldn't be President.
|
panader0
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:59 PM
Response to Original message |
8. I lay bricks. In my 35 years in the trade, I have never seen a female |
|
bricklayer. Is that sexist? Some jobs are better suited for some sexes. Still, I believe the woman to be the stronger sex.
|
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #8 |
13. Are You Saying Being President Is Better Suited For Males? |
|
Yeah, that's pretty sexist. In fact, so is saying that some jobs are better suited for some sexes. Depending on different factors, anyone from either sex can be capable of doing any job.
|
ErnestoG
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 06:59 PM
Response to Original message |
10. I am offended that you even brought it up! |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:01 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
12. Are you the president of something? |
ErnestoG
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #12 |
26. Yes. The President of being offended. Now stop it! |
OPERATIONMINDCRIME
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:10 PM
Response to Reply #10 |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 07:12 PM by OPERATIONMINDCRIME
|
DrFunkenstein
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:00 PM
Response to Original message |
11. No, But It Is Definitely Racist |
|
The times they are a'changin'. Only the GOP has an old white man running.
|
JI7
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:11 PM
Response to Original message |
19. no, i think Hillary looks Presidential |
|
as do many other women such as Barbara Boxer, Sebelius, Napolitano, etc. so no, i dno't view the word as sexist.
|
Occam Bandage
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:13 PM
Response to Original message |
20. Only if you believe that presidential qualities are exclusively male. |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:17 PM
Response to Reply #20 |
23. To this point, they are. |
Occam Bandage
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:20 PM
Response to Reply #23 |
24. There's a difference between "all presidents have been male" and "all qualities that make |
|
Edited on Sun Feb-24-08 07:20 PM by Occam Bandage
a good president have been exclusive to males." Think of any quality that you believe makes a good President, and I guarantee you can think of five women who possess that quality as quickly as you can five men.
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:26 PM
Response to Reply #24 |
28. I don't think the word s connotes good or effective qualities |
|
as much as stereotypical posturing.
|
Occam Bandage
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:28 PM
Response to Reply #28 |
30. Then this poll is begging the question. |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:34 PM
Response to Reply #30 |
33. No, just asking the question. |
Occam Bandage
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #33 |
34. I'd say it's been answered. |
Lautremont
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:25 PM
Response to Original message |
27. No, but this post is pretty Ameri-centric. |
|
Just because you guys have never had a female president doesn't make that true of the rest of us. (Not that Canada has a president at all, but you know what I mean.)
Anyway, President doesn't just refer to national leaders. There are plenty of female presidents - gardening clubs, knitting bees and whatnot must have them, I'm sure.
(That last bit is a joke, btw!)
|
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:27 PM
Response to Reply #27 |
29. This is a U.S. presidential primary forum. |
Lautremont
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:31 PM
Response to Reply #29 |
32. Doesn't mean it can be used to ascribe nonexistant meanings to widely-used words. |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:35 PM
Response to Reply #32 |
Lautremont
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:43 PM
Response to Reply #35 |
38. Well, the word "presidential," for instance, doesn't have a gender bias |
BuyingThyme
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:07 PM
Response to Reply #38 |
45. Then you should vote "NO." |
Lautremont
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:20 PM
Response to Reply #45 |
npincus
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 07:39 PM
Response to Original message |
37. List of Female Presidents here: |
|
http://www.guide2womenleaders.com/Presidents.htmNo offense, kind of a silly question. Don't see gender bias in the word.
|
Captain Hilts
(1000+ posts)
Send PM |
Profile |
Ignore
|
Sun Feb-24-08 08:17 PM
Response to Reply #37 |
49. Even though JFK said women didn't have what it takes to be prez, he did admit Eleanor R had 'it'. |
DU
AdBot (1000+ posts) |
Fri May 10th 2024, 08:08 AM
Response to Original message |