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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:16 PM Original message |
Are caucuses useful for determining our nominee? |
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PBS Poll-435 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:17 PM Response to Original message |
1. No. One Man = One Vote |
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tishaLA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:29 PM Response to Reply #1 |
9. Federalist #10's discussion of "faction" has nothing |
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PBS Poll-435 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:35 PM Response to Reply #9 |
11. Faction = A Clique or Subgroup |
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tishaLA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:48 PM Response to Reply #11 |
12. You might want to brush up on Federalist #10 |
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PBS Poll-435 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:56 PM Response to Reply #12 |
16. Fed #10 talks about subgroups. |
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tishaLA (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:08 PM Response to Reply #16 |
21. so you're arguing... |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:18 PM Response to Reply #12 |
73. Well, they are male. This feminist doesn't want to rearrange History, |
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crimsonblue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:04 PM Response to Reply #11 |
118. You're pretty obtuse if you think caucuses are a faction... |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:10 PM Response to Reply #118 |
119. It can't possibly cover all employees |
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crimsonblue (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:14 PM Response to Reply #119 |
121. ok satan's advocate... |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:18 PM Response to Reply #121 |
124. I'm questioning |
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hfojvt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-15-08 03:08 AM Response to Reply #121 |
135. we had record turn-out in this year's caucus |
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New Dawn (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:58 PM Response to Reply #1 |
18. They also supported slavery and opposed term limits for president. |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:17 PM Response to Original message |
2. No |
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tekisui (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:18 PM Response to Original message |
3. I like them mixed in with Primaries. They do not inherently favor one |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:21 PM Response to Reply #3 |
74. Bullshit. They are rife with bullies. So the stronger people |
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seriousstan (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:26 PM Response to Original message |
4. No, it is closer to mob rule than a ballot box. |
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kwenu (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:27 PM Response to Original message |
5. Exactly how does the caucus system favor one candidate over the other? |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:29 PM Response to Reply #5 |
8. That's the point of this thread. I hope we get some good responses. |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:44 AM Response to Reply #5 |
37. Well it's obvious that they dont' reflect the real will of the people |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:07 AM Response to Reply #37 |
39. participating in a democracy is much easier when it only takes two minutes |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:17 PM Response to Reply #39 |
72. sure |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 04:05 PM Response to Reply #72 |
90. You certanily make a good point, both systems have their benefits |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 05:44 PM Response to Reply #90 |
92. ""getting together with your community" is not the distinguishing characteristic |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:29 PM Response to Reply #92 |
129. I think we're discussing this somewhere downthread |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:49 PM Response to Reply #5 |
77. I'll explain. It is said that Hillary's greatest support is little old ladies, |
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Texas Hill Country (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:27 PM Response to Original message |
6. no. |
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Bucky (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:28 PM Response to Original message |
7. A system in which those who get involved and participate matter more than the apathetic? |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:23 PM Response to Reply #7 |
80. Hey dude, who the Hell are you calling apathetic? |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:13 PM Response to Reply #7 |
120. Well the superdelegates are the most involved |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-15-08 03:10 AM Response to Reply #7 |
136. The level of commitment should not hold the balance of power. If it did we would never be |
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Secret_Society (466 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:31 PM Response to Original message |
10. No...People shouldn't have to be trained how to vote |
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DemVet (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:51 PM Response to Original message |
13. Absolutely not. |
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LisaM (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:54 PM Response to Original message |
14. I don't like them for a variety of reasons. I've been to 3. |
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New Dawn (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:55 PM Response to Original message |
15. Yes, they're great. |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:31 PM Response to Reply #15 |
81. You're a riot and obviously have not read this thread. NT |
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bigwillq (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 06:56 PM Response to Original message |
17. Maybe I don't understand the caucus system |
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justgamma (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:20 PM Response to Reply #17 |
24. You don't have to chose another candidate. |
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bigwillq (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:21 PM Response to Reply #24 |
25. So my vote doesn't really count |
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thoughtcrime1984 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:38 PM Response to Reply #25 |
84. Your vote wouldn't count in primaries either |
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rinsd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:15 PM Response to Reply #24 |
70. But states with viability tests don't allow you to vote for a non viable candidate. |
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Undercurrent (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:03 PM Response to Original message |
19. I have loved going to my caucuses! |
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Oak2004 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:42 AM Response to Reply #19 |
36. Exactly |
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juajen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:35 PM Response to Reply #36 |
82. Do you vote for the Pres. nominee at those town hall meetings? |
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Oak2004 (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:14 PM Response to Reply #82 |
93. No, we decide who will be our local officials, local policies, budgets, etc. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:48 PM Response to Reply #36 |
98. What could possibly be more democratic than every single Democrat |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:46 PM Response to Reply #19 |
97. You should try your local party meetings. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:03 PM Response to Original message |
20. Voting in private is generally considered a good thing. |
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Exilednight (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:34 PM Response to Reply #20 |
28. People will always complain about them, but here's the truth .......... |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 08:08 PM Response to Reply #28 |
30. I have no idea what you are talking about. |
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Exilednight (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:03 AM Response to Reply #30 |
34. 1972 was the first nation wide primary, in the 1968 election only 13 states ........ |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:51 PM Response to Reply #34 |
59. So NONE of the grassroots organizing that goes into GOTV |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:44 PM Response to Reply #34 |
96. I've been reading up on this. |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 08:17 PM Response to Reply #96 |
100. So what? We didn't even used to pick our own nominees. Caucuses are open to all now. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:07 PM Response to Reply #100 |
105. Caucuses are open to all who can spend the time and are willing to expose themselves |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:30 PM Response to Reply #105 |
109. PA (where Hillary won) does not have early voting. If you can't vote at a certain time, tough. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:45 PM Response to Reply #109 |
112. Please clarify. |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:52 PM Response to Reply #112 |
115. PA: 8 - 7, election day only, no early voting. TX has both a primary & caucus. |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:17 PM Response to Reply #115 |
122. Why can't you discuss this |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:32 PM Response to Reply #115 |
130. OK, you are saying that the primary is the system that offers the most access, |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-15-08 02:57 AM Response to Reply #130 |
134. So I guess you haven't ever participated in a caucus & I guess you didn't like my explanation. |
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aquart (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:09 PM Response to Original message |
22. Damn useful for Obama. |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:46 AM Response to Reply #22 |
38. As they were for Bill Clinton - TWICE. Only the losers bitch about them. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:56 PM Response to Reply #38 |
62. Ah, "the ends justifies the means" argument. |
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Justitia (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:22 PM Response to Reply #62 |
79. Sorry, caucuses have been a tradition in Our Party long before Hillary Clinton couldn't win them. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:50 PM Response to Reply #79 |
99. See post #96. |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:21 PM Response to Reply #79 |
125. Why not discuss the topic |
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musicblind (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:19 PM Response to Original message |
23. no, Caucuses are not good in my opinion. Nor are Superdelegates |
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DemBones DemBones (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:24 PM Response to Original message |
26. No, and for the reasons you listed. You forgot to mention |
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justgamma (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 07:29 PM Response to Original message |
27. I have a question for those who have primaries. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 08:12 PM Response to Reply #27 |
31. Discussion isn't the issue. It's voting in private. |
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justgamma (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 10:43 PM Response to Reply #31 |
32. I understand you want your vote private. |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:11 AM Response to Reply #32 |
41. It doesn't happen. You wait in line and they give you your ballot and you mark it up. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:01 PM Response to Reply #41 |
66. Only if you consider the actual moment of voting as the only eligible |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 03:03 PM Response to Reply #66 |
86. Right. But having caucuses on a specific day that gets major advertisement |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:11 PM Response to Reply #32 |
106. Let me ask you a question... How do you elect your senators and reps? |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:17 AM Response to Reply #31 |
42. I think we're coming to a good consensus here. |
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:43 AM Response to Reply #27 |
44. All Irrelevant Side Effects That Have Not An Iota To Do With Choosing The Best Nominee For The Party |
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Bettie (774 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:41 PM Response to Reply #27 |
57. That is the great thing about the caucuses |
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Bill McBlueState (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:56 PM Response to Reply #27 |
63. there are state and local conventions |
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rinsd (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:13 PM Response to Reply #27 |
69. You can do all that at regular party meetings which is where that stuff is usually done. |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-15-08 03:13 AM Response to Reply #27 |
137. Most people are far too busy to be involved in all of that. |
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Undercurrent (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 08:00 PM Response to Original message |
29. I'd like to second justgamma's points. |
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newmajority (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Tue May-13-08 10:50 PM Response to Original message |
33. Until we can guarantee that a primary ballot is legitimate (i.e.no electro-fraud machines) |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:23 PM Response to Reply #33 |
126. Nonsense |
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crankychatter (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:06 AM Response to Original message |
35. absolutely - 100 people vote and select delegates proportionately |
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paulk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:06 PM Response to Reply #35 |
104. "Until Clinton started losing no one ever cared..." |
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RoadRage (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:11 AM Response to Original message |
40. Frankly - No. |
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OPERATIONMINDCRIME (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:41 AM Response to Original message |
43. No. They're Worthless, Completely Unrepresentative, Skewed And Should Be Totally Done Away With |
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otohara (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 11:48 AM Response to Reply #43 |
45. And If A State Doesn't Have The Bucks |
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paulk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:19 PM Response to Reply #45 |
47. why did our state have a caucus instead of a primary this time |
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otohara (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:03 PM Response to Reply #47 |
78. Money & Low Turnout |
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paulk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:35 PM Response to Reply #78 |
83. what I don't understand is - if primaries are still being held |
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otohara (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 02:50 PM Response to Reply #83 |
85. After 2008 Turnout - Primary |
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paulk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:15 PM Response to Original message |
46. I don't like caucuses |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:27 PM Response to Reply #46 |
51. You make some good points. |
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IndianaGreen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:20 PM Response to Original message |
48. Hillary said that Iowa caucus was great! |
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mystieus (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:21 PM Response to Original message |
49. Caucuses were fine until Obama got into the race. |
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stillcool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:30 PM Response to Reply #49 |
110. Ain't that the truth... |
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MonkeyFunk (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:25 PM Response to Reply #110 |
128. No, it's not the truth |
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stillcool (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:44 PM Response to Reply #128 |
131. I understand the argument |
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WeDidIt (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:23 PM Response to Original message |
50. First, some definitions |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 08:58 PM Response to Reply #50 |
103. I disagree with your definitions, and who "sponsors" (or counts the votes) |
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indimuse (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:27 PM Response to Original message |
52. 38,571 caucuse Democrats Vs. 93,757 Democrats in the Nebraska preference primary? |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:32 PM Response to Reply #52 |
53. Good points. Would you mind giving this a rec so we can put this on the greatest page? |
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indimuse (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:59 PM Response to Reply #52 |
65. I already did! |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 03:20 PM Response to Reply #65 |
89. I'm proud of DU with this thread. It's been remarkably flame-free. |
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Marrah_G (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:36 PM Response to Original message |
54. I dislike them |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:32 PM Response to Reply #54 |
76. I wouldn't like it, but I can play that game. |
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lastliberalintexas (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:36 PM Response to Original message |
55. Not really |
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Bettie (774 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:36 PM Response to Original message |
56. I live in Iowa now |
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Bill McBlueState (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:48 PM Response to Original message |
58. Construct a system that preserves the best elements of primaries & caucuses |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:55 PM Response to Reply #58 |
60. How do you write italics in your post? |
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Bill McBlueState (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:02 PM Response to Reply #60 |
67. how to do it: |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 03:07 PM Response to Reply #67 |
88. Thanks for the tip. |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:17 PM Response to Reply #58 |
107. I would introduce Instant Runoff Voting to the process too. |
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PassingFair (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:24 PM Response to Reply #58 |
127. "Fire House" Caucus.... |
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RichardRay (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:56 PM Response to Original message |
61. The Wyoming 'Caucus' |
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TheDoorbellRang (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 12:58 PM Response to Original message |
64. I think it would be more interesting to have a poll |
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TheDoorbellRang (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:12 PM Response to Reply #64 |
68. I just started a poll on this |
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Dinger (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:15 PM Response to Original message |
71. I Agree On #2 |
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Cant trust em (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 03:04 PM Response to Reply #71 |
87. States choose what process they want for themselves. |
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RichardRay (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 08:37 PM Response to Reply #71 |
102. Cost is one issue. |
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theboss (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 01:23 PM Response to Original message |
75. I think the first thing is to figure out exactly what our objective is with the nomination process |
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VotesForWomen (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 04:18 PM Response to Original message |
91. they suck just like a 6 month long primary. nt |
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sniffa (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:14 PM Response to Original message |
94. Yes, they are |
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galledgoblin (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 06:16 PM Response to Original message |
95. no, makes things much too complicated (n/t) |
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Condem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 08:33 PM Response to Original message |
101. I can't believe that no one has mentioned Diebold |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:23 PM Response to Reply #101 |
108. And there is NO ONE at the caucuses trying to manipulate the voting. |
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Condem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:45 PM Response to Reply #108 |
113. Have you been to one, MG? |
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MGKrebs (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:18 PM Response to Reply #113 |
123. You mean one for the presidential delegate selection? |
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Zynx (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Thu May-15-08 03:15 AM Response to Reply #101 |
138. Quite frankly, against the undemocratic nature of caucuses, I'm willing to take the risk. |
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Seabiscuit (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:32 PM Response to Original message |
111. They're an undemocratic farce, an engine driven by big money. |
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Name removed (0 posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:50 PM Response to Reply #111 |
114. Deleted message |
Condem (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:55 PM Response to Original message |
116. I'll bet you 90% who posted here hasn't been to one |
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quakerboy (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 09:57 PM Response to Original message |
117. On #2 |
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Blue_State_Elitist (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:50 PM Response to Original message |
132. Nah |
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CreekDog (1000+ posts) Send PM | Profile | Ignore | Wed May-14-08 10:59 PM Response to Original message |
133. they are more useful than having superdelegates decide |
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DU AdBot (1000+ posts) | Sat May 11th 2024, 08:35 AM Response to Original message |
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