Acidified ocean water rising up nearly 100 years earlier than scientists predicted

[Subdivisions]

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=view_all&address=115x150071

Also, the National Snow and Ice Data Center http://nsidc.org/arcticseaicenews/">declared that it is "quite possible" that the North Pole will be ice free during this melt season.


What the hell have we done?

What are we leaving our children and grandchildren?

[lapfog_1]

1. "Waterworld" - n/t

[Wizard777]

6. If they're lucky. Hell on earth if they are not.

[opihimoimoi]

2. We are leaving them a hugh Challenge and no hints on how to solve

The Pubs are flummoxed/bewildered/and unable to fix it....worse, they don't even want to seriesly try...

[Vincardog]

3. The Pubs owners (the parasitic corporations) are locked into winning a zero sum game that results in

everyone dieing in our own waste. We have to wake the country to the fact that Corporations are artificial constructs that do not deserve Human Rights.

[opihimoimoi]

5. Fascism has its price...even they can destroy the nest....

[ColbertWatcher]

7. We are leaving them a hugh Challenge...

...without an education on how to solve it.

FTFY

[canetoad]

4. and their children and their children's children

Man, where do we stop? Why do people of a certain age take the guilt of thousands of years on their shoulders?

We're probably close in age, but I'd be a little older, as I understand that an irrational connection to the future of the human race is an indicator or someone of breeding age or with small chilren (heir/esses).

The situation we are in now started ABOUT 1700 with the invention of the first spinning mill. It is pure posture to beat heads and breasts and wail about the 'children' when you have done nothing to redress the imbalance wrought by the industrial revolution.

Buy a lump of granite and a chisel and bash out your story. Leave it for future civilizations.

[reformedrethug]

8. "WE" have done nothing

I just have one question for you:

What ended the last ice age?

My point is simply this, mankind has not CAUSED global warming, it is a part of the natural cycle of this planet. What mankind may have done is CONTRIBUTE to it and I am not 100% convinced of that even. I am not disputing that there is climate change going on, what I am disputing is the "fact" that mankind has caused it.

I can remember 20 years or so ago that the scientists were claiming that we were heading into an ice age, now they some are saying global warming is going on and some are saying it is not, so would somebody PLEASE make up my mind?

[MedleyMisty]

9. It's not that hard to go look up some scientific articles

Your ignorance is showing.

http://www.ipcc.ch/

Also, science has this thing where it's not dogma that doesn't change for centuries and can learn and change and grow.

[RadiationTherapy]

10. Boooorrrrrrrrrrinnnng. nt

[Subdivisions]

11. Blah, blah, blah, blah, blah...3000 scientists have already

proven anthropomorphic global warming.

Try reading something about it before spouting your RW kool-aid dribble.

[hatrack]

12. " . . . scientists were claiming that we were heading into an ice age . . . "

Name one scientist. One.

Post one link to one peer-reviewed article. One.

Give any evidence - any - that what you assert is true.

Oh, and by the way, Popular Science and Time don't count. Nature, Science, Proceedings of the National Academy of Sciences and the like - those'll do.

Put up or shut up.

[reformedrethug]

13. I was talking about

when I was a kid, damn you people are TOUCHY.

As I said which apparently most of you seem to have glossed over:

I do not dispute that global warming is going on, what I question is the impact humans are having on it ie: are we causing it, are we contributing to it.

BTW, is it the norm here that if somebody does not agree with what is being posted it is automatically considered rw drivel or talking points??

I noticed that nobody has answered my original question tho:

What ended the last ice age?
What caused the last period of global warming?

[hatrack]

14. Do you have evidence to support your assertion about the "ice age"?

Do you have evidence of any kind to support anything you have said?

Oh, and in answer to your question, when what's posted looks, sounds, smells and reads like rw drivel or talking points, it generally gets treated as such.

So, any articles or evidence? But hey, take your time - it's Memorial Day weekend - no hurry!

[reformedrethug]

16. Nice open discussions on here about different opinions.

Again as I stated, this was the rage back in the late 70's early 80's. I dont think there was the internet back then but just to satisfy you I will see if I can find something when I am not spending time with my wife, going to her daughters grave, or other family type activities that I have going on this weekend.

[Subdivisions]

18. Thanks for playin'... n/t

[reformedrethug]

20. so if I dont

follow the "party line" so to speak I get dismissed?

[ProfessorGAC]

21. What Party Line?

Please quote the poster who said there is only one allowable opinion.
The Professor

[Subdivisions]

15. ...automatically considered rw drivel...

It is if that's what you're peddling.

Now, as hatrack has said, either produce a scientifically peer-reviewed study that we were to enter an ice age, or go discuss something you are knowlegdable about and let us sound our warnings without your interference.

[reformedrethug]

19. This is the google string I used:

ice age warnings in the 1970's.

The links on that page describe what I grew up hearing all the time, like we hear about global warming today. My whole point is that in my lifetime I have heard warnings about both extremes and back then unlike today we did not have the internet to use for research, we had 2 or 3 channels on tv to listen too, we simply did not have access to information as we do today.

I am not some college student posting on here, I am a 40+ year old blue collar worker turned IT guy. Maybe I look at things a bit differently, hell I KNOW I look at things differently and I will admit, reading science journals put me to sleep, its boring and dry reading to me.

All I know is for the past few years the winters have been getting worse, almost as bad as when I was a kid, the spring season has been much cooler and wetter, and the summers are not as hot as I remember. Call it what you will but that is MY climate and what I have observed.

[Subdivisions]

22. Hey, I'm a former blue collar construction

worker turned IT guy too! Cool.

Look, I apologize for being gruff. Forget the ice age. Go look at http://www.ipcc.ch/">IPCC and find the peer-reviewed research and read that too.

The term "global warming" is a misnomer, though the globe is indeed warming - not cooling. Think of it instead in terms of "climate change". The warming of this planet can indeed cause places that weren't normally so cold to become cooler. In other words, just because your winters have been getting colder doesn't mean the entire planet should also be cooling. In fact, what is happening is that climate zones are shifting. Where once it was hot and dry could become wetter and milder, etc.

Just do your research and it will lead you to the obvious conlusion that weather and climate patterns are changing as a result of anthropomorphic climate change (look up those last three).

And, BTW, welcome to DU and always be prepared to make your case with supporting materials and links.

[reformedrethug]

26. As I stated I agree that climate change IS going on

My whole point was and still is, how much of an effect do we as humans actually have on this?
And what caused the last episode of climate change, thats all I am asking.

[Subdivisions]

29. According to IPCC, a conglomeration of 3000 scientists from

across the science spectrum, climate change is being caused by HUMANS, or what is also known as "anthropomorphic climate change".

Go read.

[reformedrethug]

30. Then what caused

the ice ages of the past to go away?

See where I am going here? When the last ice age ended which I think we can agree was caused by climate change trending warmer there were no SUV's, no factories, etc... What caused it back then, and why is that so different than today?

[Subdivisions]

31. Nevermind. Go spend time with your family and have

a great Memorial Day weekend.

[reformedrethug]

32. Not trying to be difficult

just trying to understand. What is the scientific explination for past ice ages going away?
On a quick check of the two links provided neither of them seem to explain ancient ice ages but seem to focus on recent issues (recent being 1890's to now).

[Subdivisions]

33. When you've done your research, you will know the answer to

that question and how it relates to what is happening now. I'm not going to go hunt down specific sources nor am I going to do your research for you. You must study for yourself and come to your own conclusions based on your own sources. I'm not going to get into geologic and solar cycles with anyone who hasn't provided themselves with the proper research from which to engage a debate. If when have done your research and you have concluded that we're in just another solar cycle and humans injecting poison by the massive tons every single day has nothing to do with climate change, I'll be glad to discuss it further.

[hatrack]

23. Here's as good a link for the non-specialist as I know of on the basic science:

http://www.aip.org/history/climate/co2.htm

Also, if you're interested in learning more:

http://www.realclimate.org

[Subdivisions]

24. Good sources, hat, thanks! n/t

[hatrack]

25. De nada!

:toast:

[ProfessorGAC]

27. Hey! What's With The Non-English!

America hatin' ferner!

Good job on this thread, hat.
The Professor

[reformedrethug]

28. I will check them out

this weekend if I have some spare time. I have alot on my plate right now personally so when I am home I dont spend alot of time online. I just happen to have a slow day here at work today as half the workforce is off today so my workload has basically been reduced to nothing until I get a new shipment of pc's in to image and get ready to deploy.

[ProfessorGAC]

17. The Thermodynamic and Photochemical Principles Are Irrefutable

Measuring it exactly and basing the fact that it MUST be occurring on sound, proven physical and chemical principles are two different things.

If you don't know anything about thermodynamics or photochemical theories, i would suggest you look into those before drawing your highly limited conclusions.
The Professor

[PVnRT]

34. Are you deniers still touting that crap?

http://www.wmconnolley.org.uk/sci/iceage/

The "ice age" bullshit was nothing more than a media fad created out of whole cloth, but the John Birch Society and others continue to use that line and spread it around the public consciousness.

That you think that mankind pumping tons upon tons per day of a greenhouse gas into the atmosphere may not have an effect is sad.