"Right to Work" and "At Will Employment" laws are evil and vindictive. My personal reason why...

[jmowreader]

Last night I went to the store to get some final stuff for Thanksgiving. This store has a Starbucks in it, so I figured I'd get a beverage, call my wife and get the list of things she wanted. As I walked toward the cafe, I heard...

"Hey Jim!"

It was one of my favorite people!

I knew her husband (we'll call him Bobby) was doing poorly (stomach cancer) and I hadn't seen her in a while, so I asked how he was. "Oh, he died." After describing the clear-cut case of malpractice that killed him, we then talked about the place he worked at--a printing plant I'd worked at for nine years before the economy collapsed. Bobby had worked there since 1964--and the current owner bought the place in 1966.

About a month before he died, Bobby was going home from a doctor's appointment and told his wife to take him to work so he could say hi to everyone. Five minutes after they got to the shop, the plant manager called him into his office, announced that his insurance was too big a burden on the company, and fired him. The worthless fucker took a $180,000 life insurance policy out on Bobby, who was his shop foreman, with himself--NOT the company, but himself--as beneficiary.

As she put it, "this is going to be a really shitty holiday season."

[Taverner]

1. That is simply fucked up

Pardon my words

[yurbud]

4. where did you get the baracktoberfest logo?

[Taverner]

9. Schlafly Brewing in STL

They also have a Hefebiden (as well as a McCain ale, and a Palin Pale Ale)

Actually the Palin Ale description is pretty hilarious

[jmowreader]

14. I can see one little problem with Palin Ale, though...

you'd have to drink a case of Baracktoberfest beer to steel yourself for the prospect of having to look at Sarah Palin's face on a beer bottle.

[Taverner]

15. LOL true

Although you could have it on draft

[ColbertWatcher]

2. That's a perfect example of corporate greed, nor sadly, is it the only one ...

http://www.democraticunderground.com/discuss/duboard.php?az=show_mesg&forum=389&topic_id=4544190&mesg_id=4544190

January 20, 2009 can't come fast enough.

[Commie Pinko Dirtbag]

3. Isn't that, uh, FRAUD or something?

There's no way in hell the manager wouldn't get an extended stay in the slammer should that happen down here.

[Selatius]

5. Wal-Mart regularly takes out life insurance policies against its own employees.

They did it as a matter of policy for anyone who could enroll in their health care plans. Often, the victim employee did not even know the employer did this.

[Karenina]

16. They're called "Dead Peasant Policies."

[jmowreader]

20. This guy was no "peasant"

Bobby ran the manufacturing end of the operation--the pressroom, bindery, and shipping departments. The policy taken out on him would have been one of those "dead executive" policies corporations take out on key employees...and they don't get more "key" than this guy.

[pitohui]

31. peasant or key employee is irrelevant

the fraud comes if the insurance was purchased after the cancer diagnosis

[jmowreader]

33. He would have bought the insurance LONG before the cancer diagnosis

I know this asshole exceptionally well...he insured all of us right after we joined the company.

[pitohui]

the fraud part is purchasing life insurance AFTER a stomach cancer diagnosis

there's no way he would have received a $180k policy on "bobby" if the insurer knew the whole story

[pitohui]

30. sorry dupe delete EOM

m

[NNN0LHI]

6. If we don't get rid of the Taft-Hartley Act of 1947 during this administration we never will

This is our best chance ever to turn this around.

The boss is not our friend.

Stand together or hang separately.

Don

[DBoon]

10. Taft Hartley was the end of the New Deal

and the beginning of the Republican reaction that included Nixon, Reagan, and Bush (I and II)

Taft Hartley froze union membership, leaving the USA with an organized labor movement weaker than other industrialized countries. A weak labor movement means no counterbalancing pressure against corporate interests, and teh ability of corporate interests to eventually gut social democratic reforms.

Taft Hartley also (through "right to work") made the South a non-union enclave, ensuring the continuation of a feudal labor system and the continued opposition of entrenched southern politicians to social democratic reforms.

[NNN0LHI]

19. What does it take to overturn it?

Half the House and 60 votes in the Senate plus Obama's signature?

Is that all it takes?

Don

[Selatius]

32. In short, yes. The only problem is conservatives on both sides have blocked that attempt.

When Taft-Hartley originally passed, more Democrats voted with Republicans in passing it than Democrats who opposed it. It was enough Democrats such that they together with the Republicans overrode the veto of President Truman, who thought the act was an assault on the working class.

There were two occasions that labor forces came close in terms of amending the act to extend greater protections to strikers and victims of employer retaliation under both Carter and Clinton, but both failed due to lukewarm support for reform from the president and opposition from Republicans.

[DBoon]

34. yes, I think overturning its worst sections was an AFL-CIO priority

for decades after it passed

[superduperfarleft]

35. And one of the biggest advocates for the repeal of Taft-Hartley is...

Ralph Nader, DU's favorite punching bag.

(And Democrats voted for the act overwhelmingly. Just saying...)

[amdezurik]

7. that plant manager took out a policy

on her husband and was paid personally after he effectively canceled his insurance? that souds criminal to me, she needs to see about that with a lawyer IMHO

[YOY]

8. If not criminal then worthy of a beating to the point of permanent disability.

Not advocating...just saying.

[DBoon]

11. sometimes I think the Moly Maquires had the right idea

The Molly Maguires were members of a secret Irish organization. Many historians believe the "Mollies" were present in the anthracite coal fields of Pennsylvania in the United States from approximately the time of the American Civil War until a series of sensational arrests and trials in the years 1876−1878. Evidence that the Molly Maguires were responsible for coalfield crimes and kidnapping in the U.S. rests largely upon allegations of one powerful industrialist, and the testimony of one Pinkerton detective. Fellow prisoners also testified against the alleged Molly Maguires, but some believe these witnesses may have been coerced or bribed.

There is little doubt that some Irish miners conspired to commit crime; however, the trusts seem to have focused almost exclusively upon the Molly Maguires for criminal prosecution. This may be a consequence of Irish miners acting as the core of militant union activism during a bitter strike provoked by a twenty percent wage reduction. Violence during the period was widespread, with Irish Catholic miners who reportedly made up the secret organization also falling victim.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molly_Maguires

[jmowreader]

13. One of her friends is the meanest shark in town. This fuckhead is on his list

They want to get the hospital put in her name first, though. The hospital refused to feed him for seven days after he was admitted for an adverse reaction to chemo, and he starved to death.

Let me tell you a little story about him, so you can see what kind of a person he is. Basically, he would have been a perfect fit for the Bush administration except that he has no skills necessary to running the government, even into the ground. (Leave out parts about customers going elsewhere after he ripped them off, performing TLA on his wife's pillow, etc., etc., etc....) He drinks heavily. If you want to get from his office to his house you need to go past police headquarters, the county jail and the sheriff's office. Now...exactly how fucking stupid do you need to be to drive past the POLICE STATION sipping on a 40-ounce beer when you're drunk as shit already? He drank while driving five years ago when I still worked there; apparently he's much worse now.

[fortyfeetunder]

18. I think karma will get that guy in a big way

His acts are heinous and I think he will get his just due in the end.
I am sorry your friend had to suffer in the hands of that

[Juche]

21. Can you help get him on a DUI

Anything to make his life harder and hopefully cost him his job so he isn't in a position of power anymore.

[jmowreader]

25. He's gotten at least one that I know of

He should receive at least one a day, but the local police department makes the Keystone Cops look competent.

[Juche]

12. That is enraging

If you can't have him criminally prosecuted at least let his wife, kids, parents, friends, coworkers, bosses and everyone else know in depth what he did. Anyone close to him needs to know what kind of person he is.

[NNN0LHI]

17. Anyone who can do something like this doesn't care what anyone thinks about it

Close friend, relatives or otherwise.

Promise.

Don

[newtothegame]

22. Disgusting corporate greed...

But right-to-work laws aren't the problem here.

From Wikipedia:
Business interests led by the Chamber of Commerce lobbied extensively for right-to-work legislation in the southern states.<5><6><7><8> Opponents argue right-to-work laws create a free-rider problem, in which non-union employees (who are bound by the terms of the union contract even though they are not members of the union) benefit from collective bargaining without paying union dues.<5> They also contend outlawing compulsory union dues makes union activities less sustainable, that the laws prevent free contracts between unions and business owners, and that this makes it harder for unions to organize and less attractive for people to join a union. For these reasons, they often refer to right-to-work states as "right-to-fire" states, and "non-right-to-work" states as "free collective bargaining" states.

It is part of your liberty to not be forced into a union; sure there are free-riders, but that's the risk the union needs to accept if they want to organize, just like the risks of a lockout and replacement workers. We can't legislate just because we don't have the upper hand.

The problem here is individual unbridled greed, which has only been encouraged by the disgusting whores in the White House.

[Laelth]

23. I'd bet he'll never collect on the policy.

Some (often disreputable) insurance companies will allow you to take an insurance policy out on the life of a person in which you have no interest and, basically, gamble on that person's life, but they will never pay the poor sucker when the insured dies. It's against public policy here in GA to gamble on peoples' lives (too great a risk that the beneficiary will have an incentive to murder the insured). Insurance companies know they don't have to pay unless the beneficiary has a familial interest in the insured. Thus, some will let a poor sucker pay the premiums, but the insurance company will never pay. They can't because that policy will never be enforced by the Courts due to the fact that it's against public policy.

That's how it works in GA. Not sure about the state in question here.

And I agree the right to work/employment at will laws are evil. Georgia is an employment at will state.

The United States is a LIBERAL Country.

:dem:

-Laelth

[tabasco]

24. Mutts are the healthiest, smartest dogs.

People who buy from breeders are part of the problem.

[jmowreader]

26. Did you perhaps choose the wrong thread to post this in?

The villain in this thread is no dog breeder, although he's definitely a dog.

[undeterred]

28. ...

:rofl:

[bean fidhleir]

27. They should contact a lawyer INSTANTLY. Sacking someone who's ill

because they're ill has *got* to be a violation of the Disabilities act and worth major damages.

[pitohui]

29. yes this is completely illegal in the usa, assuming it occured here

my husband works for a small company where one of the long time employees has had an expensive but treatable condition for over two decades

at times, yes, the health insurance company has tried to pressure the company's owners to fire the guy because it would reduce the cost of the health insurance, however, besides being a shitty thing to do, it's ILLEGAL -- if the guy REALLY said he fired the guy to save on insurance because he has cancer (which i seriously doubt) the company is dead to rights

the one problem here is the guy described by the Original Poster actually died and while i *think* the wife has standing and can try to sue, i'm not sure, if the guy was still living, there would be no question that he could sue for back pay and lost benefits package -- a dead guy can't reasonably argue that he's entitled to a job though

i don't know anything about the life insurance package, sounds like fraud, but there are situations where so-called "janitor's insurance" is legal if unethical

she should definitely talk to a lawyer, and probably more than one, that specializes in employment litigation to find out what she is entitled to -- as the wife, in most situations, she would normally have first claim on any life insurance but this *could* be some loophole -- a lawyer will need to look at the insurance document

we have "at will" employment in my state but firing someone for having cancer is NOT allowed, it's completely illegal, hell, i've heard of lawsuits because of firing someone for getting pregnant, which is WAY cheaper than cancer

also if the man took out the policy on "Bobby" after "Bobby" was dx'd w. stomach cancer, then it's fraud, and she need only tip off the insurance company to make sure that the creep isn't awarded the $180K plus if he already got the money, he has to pay it back plus interest -- or face possible criminal as well as civil charges for the fraud

[bean fidhleir]

36. oops, you're right, my outrage made me lose track of the fact that he'd died

Your point about ratting out the scumbag to the insurance company is wonderful.

His widow really does need a good lawyer. I suspect being sacked could be shown to have hastened his death.