Detroit Goes for Electric Cars, but Will Drivers?

[DainBramaged]

Inside the Ford Motor Company, it was called Project M — to build a prototype of a totally electric, battery-powered car in just six months.

When it was started last summer, the effort was considered a tall order by the small team of executives and engineers assigned to it. After all, the auto industry can take years to develop vehicles.

But Ford was feeling pressure from competitors, and decided it could not afford to fall behind in the rapidly expanding race to put electric cars in dealer showrooms.

“Frankly, I think it’s a gamble not to do it,” William C. Ford Jr., the company’s executive chairman, said in an interview. “It’s clear that society is headed down this road.”

Certainly, Ford and other carmakers are betting billions of dollars on this new direction, at a time when they can ill afford it and when Detroit is facing government scrutiny after the $17.4 billion bailout of G.M. and Chrysler.

Throughout the cavernous Detroit auto show hall, typically the high temple of brute horsepower, auto companies will be competing this week to establish their green and electric credentials. On Sunday, when the show opens, Ford will announce plans for its electric vehicle, including a goal to start selling them by 2011.

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/01/11/business/11electric.html?_r=1&hp

[shadowknows69]

1. Here's a thought.

If they're the only thing being made I bet people would buy them.

[DainBramaged]

2. You and I know that will never happen

[Auggie]

8. If Congress had a backbone

While I do not like the idea of someone forcing me what to do or what to buy or in limiting my options, we just may be headed into situations where it would be best for that to happen.

[DainBramaged]

11. (sigh) so you think that all vehicles become electric? You don't understand technology do you?

Ever wondered why over the road trucks (you know those big boxy things that are long and scary on the highway) could never be electric powered? Unless of course you don't OWN a car and are a bicycle person who thinks we can just bike everywhere, or live in a big city and have easy access to mass transit.

Never mind. I need a break from stoopid today.

[LiberalFighter]

17. Yep! That is what I consider when buying a vehicle.

If I buy a electric power vehicle how much will be the initial cost. What are the limitations of the vehicle? Can I make long trips?

I am not going to buy a vehicle for city use and one for longer distance.

[DainBramaged]

21. I live in NJ, a small state. It is 60 miles one way from where I live to

Point Pleasant, the first of the true "shore" communities along NJ. Along with traffic (NO ONE is taking that into consideration, how much power you will use sitting in traffic on a hot summer day) I ain't making it there on one charge in an electric.

Should I pull over and 'plug in" for four hours and read a book on the way?

[Auggie]

30. You're making stuff up

I never said anything like that.

[Dont_Bogart_the_Pretzel]

3. I wonder who will buy them, that is, with all the layoffs this past year(s).

[DainBramaged]

7. Recessions/depressions are not permanent, we will emerge stronger

And the industry will STILL sell over 10 million new cars this year, down from 15,000,000 in 2007.

[eridani]

4. If they have a decent range, yes n/t

[madrchsod]

5. nic/cad batteries are going to be to expensive

and lithium/ion batteries have a tendency to over heat...at this time hybrids are still the best choice

[DainBramaged]

6. If they make a small car (smaller than a Prius) say Yaris/Fit class

and make it under $20,000 people will buy them in high numbers, but the greed of the manufacturers (ALL of them) makes that impossible. Just getting cars over 40 MPG highway for under $15,000 is a chore. People want power everything (crank windows actually devalue your car at trade in time) and except for the most economical models, everything comes with AC now.

They don't listen to anyone except marketing wonks. At least if they tried and the model failed, they'd have an excuse, but no, they haven't tried yet.

[madokie]

10. We're hoping that Ford will start producing an EV

We are not that many years away from being put to pasture and both of us would like to have an EV and have it paid for before that day comes. Yea Ford

I would rather have a picture of a Ford as the keys to anything else.

[DainBramaged]

15. Everyone (yourself not included) thinks that Detroit is hiding the technology from us

and that they can snap their fingers and poof, little electric eggs available for sale to everyone tomorrow. We may be in the digital age, but the world is still analog, and reliance on petroleum is not going away for a century or more. Besides, think of the world without any petroleum products. What would we be posting with, smoke signals?

[madokie]

18. Theres no doubt about that

I know many of 'em in real time too. I had to tell a long time friend, 40 years, last night that he has to stop listening to the likes of oxy-rush and fox news or he's going to be left behind. What I didn't tell him is he is way behind already because of his listening habits and the beliefs its spawned.

[MadHound]

20. Given Detroit's record of indeed hiding tech from us

That's not an unreasonable conclusion. After all, advances first pioneered by the Tucker, back in the fifties, some of them weren't rolled out for fifty years.

And I seriously doubt that petroleum is going to stick around for century or more. Not only is there that much affordable petroleum in the ground, but our economy simply won't stand for it anymore.

Within the relatively near future we'll all be driving electric cars, powered my energy derived from wind turbines, solar panels, or other renewable resources.

Welcome to the future.

[madrone16]

9. I love this . . .

. . . Like they haven't been sitting on the technology and prototypes for years.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Who_Killed_the_Electric_Car%3F

http://www.sonyclassics.com/whokilledtheelectriccar/

If they had kept what they started 15 years ago and built on the research, we wouldn't still be in development. If I remember the movie correctly, there were many smaller vehichles, include Ford Rangers, that were developed on an electric model. It had its problems at the time, but there was definitely an interest then and, had they kept up with promotion, research and infrastructure, we'd be well on our way to energy independence.

Couple this with the wasted potential of solar and wind power that has been waiting in the wings for decades and it becomes obvious the time and energy we've squandered on SUV's, oil and coal. In fiftteen years we could have had easily adaptable charging stations, affordability and green industries to supply the electricity.

Maybe this time big oil will have found a way to profit from the electric car.

[DainBramaged]

12. We are a generation from living the life of the Jetsons, get real

The manufacturers (ALL OF THEM) built what people wanted, period. And now, people don't want hybrids again. It's supply and demand, no one here wants to understand that.

[depakid]

22. This is precisely the sort of thinking-and demand creation that drove GM to bankruptcy

It was stupid then- and will stupider still tomorrow.

[DainBramaged]

23. OK, whatever. You are right, of course, you should be the CEO

:eyes:

[depakid]

26. Considering how it's gone

A whole lot of people could and would have done a better job.

It's almost always stupid to value short term profit at the expense of sustainability. WAMU can tell you all about that....

[DainBramaged]

27. You blame GM, what about Toyota and their reliance on gas-guzzlers?

Their sales dropped as much as GM's. And their line up is HAEVILY biased to trucks and SUVs.

Stop blaming GM for the world's problems.


Toyota: Trucks/SUV
Venza (crossover SUV disguised as a "car")
Rav4
FJ Cruiser
Highlander
4Runner
Sequoia
Land Cruiser
Tacoma
Tundra

Cars:
Yaris
Corolla
Matrix
Camry/Solara
Prius
Avalon

They make lots of economy cars, don't they?

[depakid]

28. Toyota's not on the verge of bankruptcy- and won't be

A big reason for that reason for that is their forward thinking:

The FT-EV is based on Toyota's iQ micro-car that landed in European and Japanese showrooms in 2008, though swaps that car's 1.0-litre petrol engine for a 45kW electric motor powered by a lithium-ion battery pack....

...It will be aimed at city residents who would use the battery-electric car to commute between home and work, or to drive to other forms of public transport such as railway stations.

"Last year's spike in the price of petrol was no anomaly," Toyota Motor Sales group vice president, environmental and public affairs, Irv Miller, said.

"It was a brief glimpse of our future. We must address the inevitability of peak oil by developing vehicles powered by alternatives to liquid-oil fuel, as well as new concepts, like the iQ, that are lighter in weight and smaller in size. This kind of vehicle, electrified or not, is where our industry must focus its creativity."

http://www.theage.com.au/environment/affordable-electric-car-to-hit-streets-in-2012-20090111-7e6v.html

That said- one has to applaud GM for making the effort with the volt, but it's going to take more than that to turn things around for the Big 3.

[DainBramaged]

29. They had NO INTENTION of doing electric until GM did, get real

I posted stories about this EARLY last year, Toyota claimed there wasn't enough interest. They aren't forward thinking, they just marketed better and convinced people they made a efficient line up of cars, when in reality, they are an SUV manufacturer.

[depakid]

31. "when in reality, they are an SUV manufacturer."

That's why the Prius has been on waiting lists while GM's lots were full of unsold gas hogs....

Around here, I see small, efficient Toyota models everywhere (including a few you don't have in the states).

As I mentioned- a lot of it has to do with demand creation on the part of the big 3- and it ended up their undoing. That Toyota also got on that gravy train down the line (and probably regretted it) doesn't change that fact.

btw: I'd be curious to see whether any of the big 3 in America have ever had the temerity to bring up peak oil. My guess is that would be anathema....

[DainBramaged]

32. Saved by zero, I have things to do, argue peak oil with someone else.

[depakid]

24. dupe

[depakid]

13. Better get on the ball with it

Affordable electric car to 'hit streets in 2012'



An electric car costing only $20,000 could be on sale in Australia within three years.

Japanese car maker Toyota used the 2009 Detroit motor show to unveil the FT-EV, a concept car that previews a new battery-electric "urban commuter" vehicle set to go on sale globally in 2012.

http://www.theage.com.au/environment/affordable-electric-car-to-hit-streets-in-2012-20090111-7e6v.html

[michreject]

14. Unless they can pull my 11,000 pound trailer

I have no need for them.

[NNN0LHI]

16. I need heat and a lot of it where I live. Its going to be below Ø next week here

I am not convinced that an EV can give the range and the heat required to keep everything (including me) from freezing up solid around here.

I will be happily surprised if they can.

But I am sceptical.

Don

[madokie]

19. I doubt that anytime soon they will have something that removes the need for a gasoline or diesel

powered vehicle but for most of the driving we do could be met with present day technology EV's. My first VW beetle had a gas fired heater that in hindsight I wish I still had. I wouldn't mind having a small tank that I had to put some fossil fuels in to run a heater in an otherwise totally electric vehicle.

There's many of us who could take an EV just the way the technology we have today could bring to us.

[Not Me]

25. This suits me just fine.

I have an 8-mile each way commute. I don't have a boat/camper to pull.
I recently considered my driving habits and find that I haven't driven outside my county in three months. If I can't get somewhere in 6-8 hours, I'll fly.

For those few times that I need a car for a longer trip, I could rent.

This would appeal to me.

[ProgressiveProfessor]

33. I would need one that does 60 mph and has 60 mile min range

Otherwise its a hybrid for me.

I have a solar farm on my property. My "fuel" would be free. I just need the ability to take it on the interstate and get 60 miles between chargings.