Fatal shooting started as arguement, grew into gunfight.

[Arctic Dave]

A shootout that left two men dead and two people injured at an East Anchorage bar Monday started with heated words inside the bar, then spilled into the bar's parking lot, where the fight quickly became a gunbattle, according to new court documents.

Emelio Ramirez, 35, and Ka Meng Chang, 28, died outside J.J.'s Lounge off Muldoon Road on Monday just after midnight, police said.

One man, 25-year-old Lee Chee Chang, is charged with killing Ramirez. Lee Chee Chang is Ka Meng Chang's brother, his lawyer said. The younger Chang turned himself in to police late Wednesday and appeared in court Thursday. Two others have been jailed in connection to the shootings.

It remains unclear if homicide detectives believe additional shooters are on the loose. A police spokesman said Thursday that investigators are still looking for suspects and witnesses.



Read more: http://www.adn.com/2011/10/13/2119228/fatal-shooting-started-as-argument.html#ixzz1aoQqyCuk

[SteveM]

1. Suspect charged with murder, in custody, awaiting trial. O-o-o-o-kay.nt

[spin]

2. "It remains unclear if homicide detectives believe additional shooters are on the loose." ...

Interesting. I wonder if this might involve some criminal gang activity.

[abogado]

3. Broods and clips, probably

:silly:

[spin]

4. Welcome to DU. (n/t)

[abogado]

5. Thanks, I was just, like shocked, to hear that Alaskans had guns.

:crazy:

[oneshooter]

6. Why shouldn't they have guns? n/t

[abogado]

9. Oh sorry I meant it sarcastically. I'm still learning the ropes here

haha

[oneshooter]

10. Try the sarcasm thingy, prevents a lot of confusion. n/t

[Arctic Dave]

7. Alcohol, guns and the stoopid doesn't need gang activity.

It's pretty much a given the outcome would be similar to this one with out gangs.

[spin]

8. Never underestimate the violence that occurs because of gang activity ...

This incident may or may not involve gang activity but the statement in the article is very interesting.

I do agree that alcohol and firearms are a bad mix.

[Euromutt]

11. On what basis do you make that assertion?

Any empirical evidence, or does it just "stand to reason"?

Because in my--admittedly vicarious--experience of reading news stories about arguments in bars turning into "gun battles," as in this case, with multiple shooters on one or both sides, well, that's more often than not gang-related.

The charging papers filed against Lee Chee Chang say Ramirez began calling friends, telling them to come to the bar. He told at least one person that "he needed help because he thought he was going to get jumped," the court papers say. Two of Ramirez's friends and his girlfriend either showed up at the bar or were already there. Ramirez attacked an Asian man in the parking lot and others soon jumped into the fight, witnesses told police.

Guns were drawn, shots were fired and Ramirez was hit multiple times, including once in the head, the court papers say. Police found his body in the bar parking lot and, later, shell casings of multiple calibers.

I don't know about you, but I can't whistle up several friends at short notice who are willing to bring handguns to an altercation, let alone use them (with all attendant legal consequences) when I'm the one escalating the confrontation. Not to mention the multiple guys on the Asian side who evidently "just happened" to be carrying.

Not to mention that not too many regular joes--dumb though they might be--are cold-blooded enough to put a bullet into a guy who's already down to make sure he's dead before handing the gun off to an associate for disposal.

[Callisto32]

12. This seems most plausible.

[SteveM]

13. ...but it helps. How's this for an example?....

http://articles.nydailynews.com/2011-08-05/news/29873853_1_philadelphia-bus-passengers-mother-and-child