If a Terrorist Doesn't Kill You, Someone Else Will

[undertakerlives]

I wrote an article for those who fear terrorists interminably and think they're our biggest threat. Full body scanners aren't really going to do a damn thing, folks.

http://newsblaze.com/story/20101116084720j112.nb/topstory.html

Read it and weep.

[immune]

1. Nice website.

One point of contention:

"At this point, I wish I was one of those gloriously deluded fools who think 9/11 was an inside job so I could have another reason conducive to the point I'm making, which in case you have forgotten by now, is simple: Full body scanners and searches don't save your life."

There would be no TSA goons to mess with your travel pleasure if the first Patriot Act hadn't passed congress ... a mere 45 days after 9/11. Lumbering legislators suddenly became speeding bullets to write, debate and pass that mess before anyone could even gear up to launch a protest. You believe that was possible without it at least being outlined in advance of 9/11? Speaking of deluded.

So I'll ask you, who feeds the fear? Bin Laden or the news media. And I'll agree with you that the panic is pretty stupid ... unless you happen to be someone with something to gain by making people fearful and making travel difficult.

False
Evidence
Appearing
Real

[undertakerlives]

2. My mistake.

I could have mentioned the PatRIOT Act.

However, wasn't it kind of axiomatic that they'd pass something like that without much contention in the wake of something like 9/11?

[immune]

3. Only if it was

a scheduled take down of our rights as part of the overall operation. That's all the ACT basically does, it certainly doesn't protect anyone from any of the dangers inherent to life, as you pointed out so well in your article.

[SDuderstadt]

4. Be advised...

"immune" IS one of those "gloriously deluded fools" who believes "9/11 was an inside job".

The irony of his choice of user names is not lost on many people.

[undertakerlives]

5. I wouldn't know.

Well, I'm going to give him the benefit of the doubt. If he is, more power to him. He'd be lying to himself, but more power to him.

[SDuderstadt]

6. It won't take you long...

trust me.

[undertakerlives]

7. Why?

Why do so many people believe in the conspiracy? I've seen Loose Change and heard the arguments, and when I disagree it's because I'm just an uninformed teenage moron to them.

[SDuderstadt]

9. Why don't you ask "immune" and...

find out?

As far as "Loose Change" is concerned, I think here you'll find a determined band of critical thinkers who, like you, have a "zero tolerance for bullshit" philosophy. If the idiots at "Loose Change" think you're a "uninformed teenage moron", who cares?

Unfortunately, you'll also find an active "loose change"-type brigade here. We just mostly laugh at their goofy bullshit. I rather imagine that a number of them are furiously messaging you about me, even as we speak.

[PufPuf23]

24. Hey Dude. Why won't you answer my posts in the Thermate thread?

I am a critical thinker that doesn't like bullshit and thinks most of the 9-11 conspiracy stuff (eg CT sites and Loose Change and the like) and the 9-11 Commission Report are misinfo bull sh*t.

I see a group of posters that camps in the dungeon and stifles critical thinking and bullsh*t that is not on message to a weak official narrative.

Alas the regular debunkers (and who are not above spitting BS of their own) don't like to talk to me it appears when I am bored and come here.

I am a longterm good Dem too tho I dislike neoliberalism for many reasons.

[SDuderstadt]

25. Hey, dude...

it's a violation of DU rules to do this.

[PufPuf23]

38. You want critical thinking and I made an offer to engage not a callout

Sorry if you interpret my willingness to mutually ponder as a rule violation.

I am civil but with a sense of humor and even humility.

[SDuderstadt]

39. You followed me to another thread...

which is a violation of DU rules.

[PufPuf23]

40. I apologize. Just trying to be collegial and point out

that availability for rational discourse.

I have only had one post and one subthread ever deleted at DU.

[immune]

8. Thank you for

giving me the benefit of the doubt. I do try to back up my beliefs with more than ad hominem, unlike some here. I don't know how you absolutely know that I'm merely lying to myself, there are many unanswered questions relating to 911, such as cui bono?

[undertakerlives]

10. I never assume

so don't mention it. I just don't see how these unanswered questions and so-called inconsistencies hold any water as far as the conspiracy goes.

[SDuderstadt]

13. This should be fun...

let me know when you're ready to throw up your hands in frustration with the lack of reasoning and poor command of facts you're about to encounter.

[immune]

14. A lot of people don't see it and I really can't fault them for it

unless they're downright rude to those of us who believe there is a lot more to see if you look.

You certainly won't be given any clues about what really happened that day on Fox Snooze or right wing hate radio. But more evidence that something was wrong with the official stories and reports is being brought forward every day and more people are looking at it and saying, "what the hell is going on here".

I hope you find interesting things to read about here in the September 11 dungeon. :think:

[zappaman]

11. "I do try to back up my beliefs"

copy and pasting long debunked bullshit from all the CT sites you frequent is hardly "backing up your beliefs".

[undertakerlives]

12. Come on now

OK, if things are going to get hostile, then let's just have a full on debate - with real evidence, since I'm a newbie around here.

Glad to see the life was sucked out of my article...

[immune]

15. Sorry for the disruption,

I seem to have acquired a couple of pull toys here that I can't shake.

BTW, a belated welcome to the dungeon. :hi:

[undertakerlives]

17. I will say this

immune has showed a lot more tact and courtesy than anyone else in this thread. Everyone else pretty much attacked him. Whatever he's downcast for in other threads, that's all good and well, but he showed more class than anyone else here at least.

[SDuderstadt]

19. "tact and courtesy"

Wait until you encounter some of his tactics. Taking issue with someone posting bullshit is not an attack.

[immune]

20. Thanks.

The question I have is has anyone else even bothered to read your article before jumping in for the attack.

[undertakerlives]

31. The article

Yeah, I doubt anyone really read it, but it happens in a forum. Tangents come and go.

[SDuderstadt]

18. "immune" "seems to have acquired...

a couple of pull toys" he "can't shake", because of the absolute nonsense he posts.

Beyond that, when provided with actual answers to the "unanswered questions" he keeps going on about, he just arbitrarily shakes them off, then posts more goofy CT bullshit.

[undertakerlives]

16. Back on topic...

If we could all stick to the topic at hand now...

[SDuderstadt]

21. Back on topic...

I think your point about the adoption of the Patriot Act being axiomatic in the aftermath of 9/11 is spot on. Those suspicious that it must have already been "in the works" lack a basic understanding of how Congress works and are, most likely, blissfully unaware of the bill-drafting services available to members of congress.

[immune]

22. The Patriot Act

accomplished what, besides adding more restrictions on your freedom and probably affording you less safety today than you had before it was enacted.

[SDuderstadt]

23. While I am hardly defending the Patriot Act...

in toto, I am willing to bet that immune has not even read it.

[immune]

26. "In toto"

Good, we can read anything we want to into that open ended claim. Could be you only liked the title of the Act.

You sound like a betting man. Got some dinero to blow?

[SDuderstadt]

29. Eventually, "immune" will...

click to the fact that I will not interact with him directly.

Call me naive.

[undertakerlives]

30. Well

Whatever suits you I suppose.

[SDuderstadt]

32. I have excellent reason for...

doing so.

[undertakerlives]

33. Enlighten me

as to what this reason is, since I'm not sure why he seems to be easy to pick on around these parts.

[SDuderstadt]

35. I alluded to it before...

it has to do with tactics he employs...stick around and you'll see.

[undertakerlives]

27. In the works

I don't believe the Act was in the works at all, it was merely a reactionary bill set forth by an imbecile who probably thought the Constitution was a children's book.

[SDuderstadt]

28. I agree...n/t

[immune]

34. So, the people

who swore oaths to uphold the Constitution as a prerequisite to holding office decided to break those oaths "to keep us safe" (which, of course, they haven't done and as any fool would realize, they cannot do). So did they have their fingers crossed behind their collective backs when they took that oath of office? And if so, why should we believe another word they say? If they later realized the Act was reactionary and unconstitutional, why have they added to it rather than revoking it altogether?

Who do they serve?

[undertakerlives]

36. Politicians are equals in bullshit

Democrats are crowd pleasing cowards. Republicans are greedy, overly religious and concerned with property and guns over human rights. That's how I personally see politics - a lot of money and bullshit. Note I said that's how I see POLITICS, not POLITICIANS. That's a different story.

Like I said in the article, people are willing to give up some liberty for the illusion of protection, people were impressionable after 9/11 and eager to eat sensationalism. They knew that, and that's why the PA was passed.

The day a politician holds a promise is the day the Earth stalls. Then again, they're no more dishonest than the average person.

[immune]

41. Excellent points all.

But I do recall some very loud protests both before and after the passage of the Patriot Act. Unfortunately, the constitutional dissenters didn't even have a chance to get their arguments put together before that puppy was rammed through. Legislate in haste, repent in leisure.

[zappaman]

37. agree

and everything thing we have done in terms of air safety is still just reactionary.
if someone comes up with a plan using luggage as a weapon, luggage will be banned.

[deconstruct911]

42. Just remember

don't turn a blind eye now, or they will have to blow up more trains to remind everyone of the "Al Qaeda" threat.