(Virginia) State police chaplains resign over prayer restrictions

[Blue_Tires]

Source: The Richmond Times-Dispatch

At least five members of the Virginia State Police chaplains program have resigned after being told they must abstain from praying in the name of Jesus or Christ during department-sanctioned events involving the public.

Concerned about offending people of other faiths, state police Superintendent W. Steven Flaherty recently directed the agency's 17 chaplains to begin delivering neutral or non-denominational prayers at events such as trooper graduation ceremonies and its annual memorial service for fallen officers...

Their cause has been taken up by Del. Charles W. Carrico Sr., R-Grayson, who has contacted the Virginia Attorney General's Office for counsel and is launching a Web site -- InJesusNameIPray.com -- in a push to have the decision overturned.

"It's a separation of Jesus and state, which offends me greatly," he said. "What we have here is an attack on the name of Jesus, on the name of Christ. And I'm not going to sit back and just let it happen."




Read more: http://www.inrich.com/content/cva/ric/news.apx.-content-articles-RTD-2008-09-24-0224.html

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LEO and now current state legislator doesn't even know the constitution...

[Ian David]

1. InJesusNameIPray

[dmallind]

2. No doubt we will see Bizzaro World responses

You know the ones. They somehow manage to change not being allowed to force your views on a captive audience with the imprimatur of governmental authority as being equal to persecution and lack of free exercise for the individual proselytizer.

[fascisthunter]

3. Oh Puhleeeeze... What We Have Here is an Attack on Our Secular Government

by a bunch of religious extremists who want to live in a theocracy while most do not. Nothing even remotely Democratic about their agenda.

[grilled onions]

4. No One Is Stopping Their Faith

No one is stopping their prayers. YOu would think allowing them their prayer would suffice(as if anyone can stop anyone from praying silently 24/7) if they wanted to. What bothers them is that they have to "name brand" their religion to the world and won't except other "brands", that others may prefer another choice. Religious people are supposed to tolerate others not except the forest to sway entirely in one direction.

[jeepnstein]

7. Here's the rub...

The State of Virginia wants these chaplains because they give a veneer of religious concern if not authority. They want the appearance of religion but not the actual practice. You can't have it both ways. This is exactly why I am so bitterly opposed to any form of governmental involvement in matters of the Church. Politicians would have the church subservient to the state. I trust them with this right as much as I do with my other Constitutional Rights, not at all.

When I'm asked to pray in public I do it in much the same manner that I do it in private. This doesn't mean I find prayer to be a license to hurt or offend but rather I use it as an opportunity to show the world how I feel it is proper to address our Heavenly Father. The Lord admonishes us to do our praying in private and not be like the Pharisee that flaunts his "holiness" for the world to admire. A public prayer, therefore must be done in the spirit of humility and love.

[katandmoon]

5. WTF does the Virginia State Police have a chaplain program?!

[MissMillie]

6. I'm betting it works w/ the victims' assistance people

but that's just a guess.

[Blue_Tires]

8. most likely formal events, memorials for falen officers

and counsel for those who shoot in the line of duty, i guess...

[KSDiva]

9. This may be an unpopular response...

But if they are going to have chaplains and the like, I would think the state needs to accept that Christianity would go along with it. It would be like hiring a Catholic priest and telling him, "No, you can't cross yourself around the rest of the people."

To quote my father, the state needs to either shit or get off the pot. You can't have things halfway -- you either hire a religious leader for things and they bring religion into the mix, or you keep it secular.

I do have to say the guy complaining about the sep. of Jesus and state though, was a little scary. But when you open the door and invite religion in, you have to expect that.

[Daemonaquila]

12. Heck no

First of all, the expectation that Christianity would be the religion to be accepted is truly out of line. That's like saying we might as well make Christianity the accepted state religion because there are so many Christians/Christian chaplains. Accepting some faith practitioners into state service for ceremonies, counseling, etc. requires that they do NOT show preference for one religion over another, and especially not use that position as a place to proselytize.

Some quotes from the Requirements and Guidelines for Military Chaplains (Catholic Church):

"A military chaplain must be prepared to provide for the free exercise of religion for all the members of the Armed Forces who come under their care, regardless of denomination or religion. They must be able to provide a wide range of religious services and pastoral care to those in uniform and to their families, regardless of faith preference."

"The likelihood that you will be required to serve those of other faiths means that military chaplains must be better trained than the average civilian pastor. You must have a deeper understanding of other religions, and a sensitivity to the needs of their members. You may be called upon, for example, to assist Jews and Muslims in having their dietary requirements met. That's why you should have at least a rudimentary knowledge of what those requirements are, and where they come from. You should also know what exemptions from following these rules are granted to members of the military by various faiths. Often, all that's required is assurance that "It's OK." As a chaplain, your job is to enable the troops to be at peace with themselves and with their God (not yours)."

There are Jewish, Muslim, Druid, Wiccan, Hindu, and a gazillion other kinds of chaplains out there. The true professionals among chaplains understand the boundaries regarding promoting their persona religion, and respect them. These yahoos know exactly what they're up to - misusing their chaplaincy to evangelize. They shouldn't be quitting - they should be stripped of their chaplaincy and run out in disgrace.

[yellowcanine]

10. "It's a separation of Jesus and state, which offends me greatly," It offends ME that you want to

join Jesus and state, Charlie. There is this little thing called the Constitution that you are treading on.

[marias23]

11. Pray to Your God PRIVATELY

What is so hard to understand that no one is restricting anyone's right to pray in their own way - privately. What is restricted by the Constitution - that they presumably swore to uphold - is any relationship between government and religion.
I really wonder how these people would feel if these services invoked Moses or Mohammad?

[Stump]

13. Even Jesus asked for this.

Pray in private.

[iluvatar]

14. SO THESE ARE AMBASSADORS OF CHRIST?

SO THESE ARE AMBASSADORS OF CHRIST?

Six volunteer Chaplains have resigned, abandoning their ministry to “individual employees and their families in their time of need” —WHAT KIND OF CHRISTIAN TESTIMONY IS THAT?

State Police Superintendent Colonel W. Stephen Flaherty asked “Department chaplains to offer non-denominational prayers at Department-sanctioned, public events…The Colonel respects those chaplains whose convictions and beliefs are in conflict with his request, and is affording those Department chaplains the opportunity to decline participation at Department-sanctioned, public events. The Superintendent's request does not affect chaplains offering their services at private ceremonies (i.e. funerals) or when counseling individual employees and their families in their time of need.”

These Chaplains quit their ministries IN JESUS NAME. And, in doing so, VIOLATE THE COMMANDMENT:

Exodus 20:7:
“You shall not misuse the name of the LORD your God, for the LORD will not hold anyone guiltless who misuses his name.” New International Version.


Over the years it has become clear to me that Christ is not likely to abide in the hearts of folks whose lips so often speak JESUS’ NAME. Far too many Evangelical and Fundamentalist Christians worship a jesus-IDOL which is nothing more than an excuse to judge others as being the cause of any & every wrong (real or imagined) while not considering for one instant there own actions, words & thoughts. THE EXACT OPPOSITE OF JESUS’ TEACHINGS:

MATTHEW 7
Do not judge, or you too will be judged. 2 For in the same way you judge others, you will be judged, and with the measure you use, it will be measured to you. 3 "Why do you look at the speck of sawdust in your brother's eye and pay no attention to the plank in your own eye? 4 How can you say to your brother, 'Let me take the speck out of your eye,' when all the time there is a plank in your own eye? 5 You hypocrite, first take the plank out of your own eye, and then you will see clearly to remove the speck from your brother's eye.

IN JESUS’ NAME many folks who have posted here indulge in some perverse pleasure by pretending to be persecuted Christian Martyrs and taking it out on their neighbors. These folks are, IN JESUS’ NAME, promoting, an unhealthy Carl Rove-style Politically Correct Popular Culture of Crybabies who constantly whine, “everyone is picking on us.” What a sick counter-Christian fantasy! No one is persecuting these people; and yet, THEY CAN’T EVEN BARE THEIR IMAGINARY CROSSES IN A CHRIST-LIKE MANNER:


MATTHEW 5:
10 Blessed are those who are persecuted because of righteousness, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. 11 "Blessed are you when people insult you, persecute you and falsely say all kinds of evil against you because of me. 12 Rejoice and be glad, because great is your reward in heaven, for in the same way they persecuted the prophets who were before you.

When—in light of the JESUS I’ve read about in the Gospels—I consider the behavior of many Evangelical & Fundamentalist Christians a 21st century version of the ABOMINATION THAT CAUSES DESOLATION, (about which JESUS & Daniel warned their contemporaries) comes to my mind. AT ANY RATE THESE FOLKS ARE NOT EMULATING JESUS CHRIST:

MATTHEW 5:
3 "Blessed are the poor in spirit, for theirs is the kingdom of heaven. 4 Blessed are those who mourn, for they will be comforted. 5 Blessed are the meek, for they will inherit the earth. 6 Blessed are those who hunger and thirst for righteousness, for they will be filled. 7 Blessed are the merciful, for they will be shown mercy. 8 Blessed are the pure in heart, for they will see God. 9 Blessed are the peacemakers, for they will be called sons of God.


Given that Evangelical Christians have been the single largest political constituency in the United States since 1979, a good case could be made that they are responsible for whatever moral decline may have occurred in our country. It is certainly true that Fundamentalists & Evangelicals played the vital role in dismantling the work of my parents generation—rightly called ‘The Greatest’—who endured the Great Depression, fought WW II, rebuilt Europe & Asia, and went on to create the America that people world-wide loved, respected & admired!

[underpants]

15. Why do we have Chaplains on the State Police payroll?

That is a violation of the first amendment.

[VaYallaDawg]

16. Apparently they are regular troopers who serve as chaplains

when needed. A state trooper friend informs me that even though these individuals have "resigned," the only thing they "resigned" was their status as chaplain (for which they aren't paid extra anyway). They peform their services as needed for funerals, bereavement, ceremonies, etc.