Is anyone aware of a book that speculates how the world would have evolved

[chelsea0011]

if dinosaurs weren't wiped out?

[digonswine]

1. From what I know-not much-

we would have stayed tiny mammal-like critters. No way to know. Any book would be pure speculation-like my post.

[villager]

2. well, there were "advanced" dinosaur species toward the end..

...i.e., the last mere "million years" or so before the wipe-out, that walked on two legs, had fairly large brain capacities, and could reach with their "arms" and finger-like claws. The eyes seemed to be close enough to allow for some degree of depth perception:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Troodon

So -- the theory goes -- if the dinosaurs hadn't been wiped out, would this species have kept evolving, like our hominid ancestors, into some Saurian equivalent of a "human being?"

More far-ranging theories say such species have evolved -- elsewhere (off-world?) --to become the "grey aliens" of modern lore...

[txlibdem]

14. Had they done so, they would have had 65 million years on us

Perhaps they evolved into a space-faring race and we may find their outposts or stargates out there somewhere...
(while we're speculating)

[TheManInTheMac]

3. I think the dinosaurs were doomed

when mammals first arrived. The comet is the preeminent theory today, but anthropologists used to speculate that early mammals ate their eggs and drove them to extinction. That theory might still be out there.

Or maybe I dreamed it. I don't know. I reckon evolution would have kicked Jurassic ass eventually, comet or no.

[muriel_volestrangler]

5. Mammals evolved not long after dinosaurs did, and they co-existed for most of the history of mammals

There's argument about what was a true dinosaur, and what was a true mammal; but you can push dinosaurs back to about 250 million years ago, and mammals to 190 million years ago. Dinosaurs didn't die out until 65 million years ago.

Before the dinosaurs became the dominant land animals, it had been the synapsids, which were the ancestors of the mammals. There's no reason to think that mammals were 'out-evolving' the dinosaurs and their relatives such as the birds.

[TheManInTheMac]

12. Thank you.

It's too late for me to read your links, but it is so refreshing to find someone willing to share good information on a message board.

[muriel_volestrangler]

4. Fiction, or well-based science speculation?

For fiction, you can try Harry Harrison's 'West of Eden' trilogy. Scientifically, it's bunk (it has humans just the same as we did anyway, in addition to intelligent dinosaur descendants, but only in North America - no sign of them in Africa), but it gives 'what if?' a go.

[Hardrada]

6. I thought Adam and Eve rode to church on dinosaurs.

Was I misled?

[bananas]

7. They weren't wiped out, they became birds and other creatures.

Ok, some of them were wiped out, but others became birds, iguanas, etc.

[DetlefK]

8. SF-wise: dinosaurs evolving to a Stone-Age civilization

Stephen Baxter's "Evolution".
And not really Stone-Age, as they don't get past wood and leather.

AFAIR it's only one or two chapters of the whole historic story-arc of the novel.

[sofa king]

17. I recall another one...

But I can't remember the title or the author. The premise is closely based upon AC Clarke's Rendezvous With Rama, only this time, the giant rotating cylinder parks in Earth orbit, and when astronauts find their way inside, they discover it's a complete Cretaceous ecosystem with T-rexes and all the rest.

At one end of the cylinder, the explorers discover a race of intelligent dinosaurs who have walled off one section, and open a line of communications with one, whom the humans name "Thesaurus." It is unclear whether or not the thesauruses have created this spacecraft and lost their prior civilization, or if they evolved in transit.

In a hilarious bit of self-flagellation, the author or authors have an ancient science fiction writer from the "golden age" (who seems a lot like C.M. Kornbluth had he lived) sent up to meet the intelligent dinosaurs... and they eat him.

Anyone remember that one? I remember enjoying it.

Edit: I believe the book speculates that the particular species from which the intelligent critters evolved was one of the ones with the large hollow chambers in their skulls, and their brains evolved to take up the empty space.

[Johonny]

9. Ever see a bird

[kestrel91316]

15. Corvids may yet evolve into something advanced like humans, if we

don't kill their environment off. They are damned smart birds. Some make and use tools, and they can communicate enough to send kin to attack particular humans that have harmed them in the past (Japanese crows?).

[rug]

10. West of Eden, scifi by Harry Harrison, speculates they would have evolved into

an intelligent, biology-based society.

A fun read.

[NickB79]

11. Yep. Look up Dougal Dixon's "The New Dinosaurs"

A bit dated, from 1988, but still pretty interesting.

[chelsea0011]

13. Thanks...I'll do that

[semillama]

16. Didn't also do a speculative biology book, "After Man"?

I really enjoyed those books as a teenager. I wonder if I still have them somewhere for my son when he's older...